Hispanics...What to do with THEM !!
 

Hello,

With all due respect to my precious brethen and with an angle from a minority(Minority in this nations eyes (but not in Jesus' eyes).

I have lived all my life(42 years) in the south and have been in the Truth the last 20 years.

I have been under precious men of faith BUT there has always been that "understood unspoken law" , caucasians lead, everyone else follows.

I attempted to get my Lic. back in 1992 , not allowed because the Pastors son had to be the first one to get his Lic. at that church since he was next in line for the church.

I waited and waited nothing, I have read all the books , preached done all I was asked and nothing met all the requiremnets placed before me and nothing. I moved to TX where at least 50% of the congregations are made up of "minorities" at least in my area and yet NOT ONE "minority" pastor.

Many years ago there was always a stigma that was placed on the black race as "being to dumb" to know or do anything right, well now it has been extended to the Mexicans, Puerto Ricans, Indians shall I go on.

There really is a problem, and I am happy Jesus is not like most in leadership in this area because you see GOD has used me in services full of Caucasians even if they won't.

Its a reality, sad, and even if done subconsciously its still wrong. I hold no bitter feelings , it just saddens me because I know if I notice it many thers do also.

I posted this on a different thread earlier and in doing so I might have given the impression that I am black, sorry for that I am a Hispanic and decided it deserves its own thread.

The UPCI is currently dealing with an issue it should have addressed long ago and I am right now saying in a not to distant future this will be another major one.

Currently there are some assistant Hispanic pastors out there but how many pastors can honestly say you have encouraged them to start their own Spanish UPCI churches to step out and grow?

The Hispanic population is expanding in double digit growth and if the UPCI does not recognize this and see the need to nurture/train/help those who are willing, ready and very able those slighted will rightfully finally take a stand.

Sour grapes, no by no means, I want in no way shape or form for this to ever be an issue, but step back and take and honest look and ask is there any credence to this.

Are you in Texas now? There is a pretty solid gruop of Hispanic pastors in Texas. Texas has a pretty robuts Hispanic youth camp as well.


I agree that not enough is being done in reaching minority communities including hispanics but I think there is more progress than you are stating here.

Manuel Alicea, one of the pioneers of the Spanish Ministry in the UPCI. He was a pastor of his own church for 28 yrs until God chose to call him home. I have the honor of calling him Dad!

http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/d...nuelAlicea.jpg

In the section I am there are zero hispnic pastors(plenty of helpers) but no pastors.

The hispanic community easily makes up over 40% of the congregations, and there is the progress

I don't have a picture to put up but my Dad has been a UPCI Spanish Pastor of his own church for 24 years. we were never anyone's daughter church.
he started it from scratch

If it were that simplistic the goal would have been achieved long ago....

Chosen, I think you have been given 2 very fine examples. I also know in Texas, there is a solid network of Hispanic pastors who would help you.

Amen!

I believe the issue is not that it has been an odyssey with me but that it has been an issue at all. In other words why is there a need to jump through hurdles, to go out of my way to simply want to work?

I respect hierarchy and understand protocol and so forth but you and I both know very well that if I go outside "my" immediate leadership network for help in this , it will be frowned upon by the ones over me and I may will be labled a "rebeller" for not following sop (which I have to no avail).

Sorry but I don't see the problem.There is an org of spainish pastors.The UPC is not the only org.There are many oneness orgs.Maybe its because you belong to an org that just doesn't have alot of spainish pastors.That could be the problem.

Hey, I'm old enough to remember when the UPC Manual had a separate listing for "Colored" ministers at the back of the book.

Some progress has been made.

what color???:reaction

Oh yes I understand the UPCI is not the only oneness org and I do not want to leave I love the bretheren. You have just offered me the option to leave and that would seem counter productin especially with current events.

sad...well at least we've come a little farther

Sorry but I don't think its a problem.The UPC is a ministerial org.Go to the presbyter and district board and apply.That is all I ever did.You pay your dues don't you? Anything I ever needed from the UPCI I just called headquarters and asked for the appropriate person and voila just like that it was in the mail or I was given the number of the person who could help me.
Its not an org that is going to give you a ministry.Jesus gives the ministry.
The org is simply a network of ministers to help you in what you are already doing.

If I were a pastor, then I would definately have you in leadership. Does that make you feel better? LOL!

thank you for your input

I am sure you would brother....right behind you

Hey be thankful your not a woman trying to get a license. :)

hahaha...been there done that and surprisingly the brethren voted unanimously.lol.

That's great!

I have not gone that route, not yet anyway. Don't know that I will. Time will tell. :)

Oh, you want me to give you the place God called me to? Do you get it now? If you want to be in the pastors position, then you got to be willing to go through the hurdles, no one is going to give it to you. My dad was a home missionary, I told him that I would never become a home missionary because of the so called "hurdles". Is this really about race as much as it is about a position?

Actually I was preaching church to church for ten years before I did.We all
need confirmation sometimes.I have to say the brethren stood with me and
were awesome.

Brother I seek not position but only what God has called me to.
I don't want anything given to me.
All I seek is help.
I have helped, supported, and was a member of 3 home mission works.
I know very well what is involved.
The "hurdles" are not God made obviously but man made.

Interesting thread, seems to be more related to vocation than divine calling....:highfive

Sorry Brother..your discernment is off, wayyyyy off

BTW may I ask ,without the fear of being excummunicated why the touchinesss brother? I responded in jest to your jest and then you went south on me, why? Did i speak out of turn or place?

Being totally honest you must admit having dad as a pastor did nothing but help you and I am sure there were little to no hurdles involved in your "calling".

Chosen I did not have a dad or anyone in the church and God has helped me.Being of the female persuasion I could say alot of things.We are a minority in the pentecostal ministry.I have never looked at anything that has happened to me but a learning process and a way God used to keep my attitude right.

Chosen I have to disagree w/ you ... although in many areas there is a lot to be desired on how the UPCI is handling the multi-cultural ministries in the fellowship and the approach used w/ Spanish ministries ... however the fasting growing segment in the UPCI is Spanish ministries. As a person who was actively involved in the promotions area of SEM ... I can tell you that there is great revival in the UPCI when it comes to Spanish ministries ... Very soon Spanish ministers will make up 10% of the fellowship's constituency.

I've seen explosive growth since my childhood in Spanish Ministries within the UPCI ... when my dad took pastorship of one of the first Spanish UPCI churches...

Your problem is more regional/local than national.

It is that simple.

Sorry brother you are wrong as far as this area goes, I know of others who have gone through and are still enduring what I am speaking about but I think I will stop here because it seems this is taking a life of ots own and drawing contention from some which wasn't and isn't my intention.

I cannot disagree with what you have experienced or know, neither can you with me.

Chosen ... I've sat in national SEM board meetings ... my dad served on the National board too ... I know the success stories and the horror stories ... and have analyzed the dynamics to them all .... your complaints are not new .... and trust me anyone here can tell you I'm no org sycophant so I am not advocating a system .... I don't even hold a license w/ the org any longer ...

What I see is a young man w/ a desire ... to do something for the Kingdom of God .... but in the end game ... you're focusing on the minors as to why there is no "revival" in your area ... "The Man" is not the problem, here.

It's great to be funded .... and supported ...
yet this comes w/ a lot of baggage, bro. And many times greater troubles.

There is no replacing an anointing of the Holy Spirit ... and a volition to do God's work .... Go out and do it.

Or find a group that shares your vision ... it will still require action.

I agree wholeheartedly here.

Chosen I pray God's best for your ministry and you are my brother in Christ.

Daniel, I cannot pass up the opportunity to agree with you...since it comes rather rarely. LOL

You are absolutely right.

When I was in Memphis we had a Spanish daughter work that is now self-supporting and autonomous. It runs close to 200 now.

We had calls all the time from pastors wanting to know if I knew any Spanish-speaking preachers that would be interested in starting a daughter work in their town. Until he got too busy, our Spanish pastor also headed up the District Spanish work. The need for Spanish preachers is incredible.

We constantly stayed on the lookout for someone qualified to recommend. If anyone has an opportunity in the apostolic church in North America it is a dedicated Spanish-speaking preacher.

I just can't imagine a man with true anointing and dedication that speaks Spanish being held back in the UPC or in any apostolic church.

Chosen may God be with you and bless your ministry.

I lived in Miami for 2 years and I said over and over if someone wants to go to the mission field they should go to South Miami if they speak Spanish. What an opportunity to live in America and be a missionary. The prospects are limitless.

Well brother its not imagination its reality.

Unfortunately not all sections, districts, areas ect are like yours.

I never said the UPCI was racist , but I have stated what I have dealt with, in so doing some have misread me as looking for hand outs, slothfulness or just being ignorant to the way things are done.

As some have shown authority/position corrupts when one is not ready for it.

We run 40 in our service in a town where there is no UPCI within 35 miles.
God is healing people, some have prayed back through and there are many new ones yet I can't get my Lic and I do not want to go independent, why should I.

I don't need charity and don't want it GOD has always provided.

I'll go ahead and brace for the repercussions from this post.

I'm sorry. I thought you were more concerned about being in a "leadership position" because of your ethnicity. I was merely trying to rebutt your argument of racial discrimination based upon your background. I do not see where there is no UPC ministers that are caucasian exclusive. As far as the so called "hurdles", they are not all man made.