Should they leave or stay?
 

The local church? I was wondering your opinions. Some saints under a very strict Pastor does not agree with a lot of what he teaches....should they just stay and obey and keep unity? Should they stay but walk their own walk? Or should they go and "good riddance" to them?

Disunity hinders revival.They should pray and do what Jesus says.Strict is one thing.Cultish is another.

It depends. Some "strict" pastors are actually quite tolerant as long they're not getting a bunch of "in your face" type of feedback.

If they cannot peacefully coexist, then they need to go where they can peacefully exist. No "good riddance" is in order. All parties should act as brethren and treat one another with mutual respect.

Great question, but one that has to be answered individually. I don't think we should sit on the pew if we can not submit to what is being taught. If we stay and "do our own thing" we are being rebellious, and while we ourselves may be able to still keep our relationship with God we may be a stumbling block to another. The second time I left it was because I didn't agree with the teaching, and I did not want to be rebellious so I went my own way. I still worship, pray and praise, but not at that church. To many I would be rebellious no matter which I choose unless I just stayed and followed along blindly whether I felt it was right for me or not! I think most of us know in our spirit when something does not feel right, that is what the HG is for to help us discern, and I trust my HG...my Lord, my Jesus.

Agreed!

To question anything a pastor, church, or religous org. says, does, or requires is obviously rebellion.

Rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft.

So the answer is a resounding "NO". You can never question anything. If things happen you don't agree with it just means you are carnal.

If one cannot come under subjection to a pastor and comply with the standards taught they need to find somewhere else to attend church.

How can anyone give a definitive answer to that question? It would depend on all kind of things what to do.

In some cases, it might be best to leave. In other cases it might be best to stay.

Depends.

They should find a place that more closely fits with where they are in their walk. No place is a perfect fit, so no "good riddance" is appropriate from either.

You said it even better than I.:thumbsup

I agree with the overall thought but disagree with the word choice of "subjection". I do not think ANYONE needs to be under "subjection" of any other human.

However, I think people need to be under someone they respect and someone who has earned that right to be respected. I will follow the advice of someone I disagree with if I have respect for them and believe they may know something I don't. However, if all they ever tell me is an endless list of their own personal convictions I am sure as shootin not going to listen to them when it comes to something important and WILL find somewhere else to go.

Good chance that the saints built and maintain the church.

It's the money contributed by the saints to pay salary's at that church.

Sounds like that Pastor might want to find another church to attend.

It's the difference between a liberal and conservatives view of government. The conservative looks at government as a necessary evil who should get as little of the citizens income as possible while the liberal looks at EVERYTHING being governments and government then ALLOWING (out of the kindness of their own hearts) the citizens to have a few token pieces of wealth and freedom.

What if I agree with my pastor in every area that he preaches, but I want to keep my license in the UPC and he doesn't?

My father has always said, if you don't feel like he is preaching truth, and you can't be saved under his ministry, run, don't walk to the church that you feel like you can be saved in.

It depends if there is another church in Greeley, CO that you COULD attend!

:killinme

Our problem used to be that the church I went to was THEE only church you could be saved in. "All the rest were not the best"

Seriously...we were led to believe we just could not leave and go any where else and be saved.

EVERYBODY else was to liberal or backslid.....and NO my pastor was not Whole Hearted. :icecream

I will agree with this view.

It ought to be that yall can still work together in the kingdom,union card or not.
If he turns in a card ,is he any less in the kingdom of God ?
If yall are likeminded yall should be able to work together across organizational lines.

If I felt like I couldn't obey what was being preached I would go elsewhere.

There was a young -man who prayed through in our church ,he lived in another community,and he started attending a strict ind.UC work and I told him if he attended there he should comply with what they taught if that was to be his home church.

I believe the policy is that if you are a UPC minister, you cannot be a member of a non-UPC church...

Is that Kingdom of God policy or man-made policy ?

Where do you find scripture to back up the statement of people being under subjection to a pastor?

Been there... I've actually heard them say that you have no other choice.

But what if the org says you can't stay with the church unless the pastor remains in the org? For what its worth, I agree that we should be able to fellowship.

The saints should go Toilet paper his house! :highfive

:eek:

:tvhappy

When one cannot agree with and obey what is being preached they need to leave. To stay there and be in rebellion is wrong.

So... in any given situation there is only one party who can be wrong? That being the saint?

and when they leave, what is the pastor to do?

Should he announce to the church why they left.

Demand that the church have no fellowship with them, no phoncalls, no letters.

Speak ill of the "reprobate backsliders" to everyone. (Even though it was a disagreement of not being able to put a shiny pen in your pocket" or some other stupid man contrived rule)


This is the way folks who left our church were treated. Even ones who left to pastor a work elsewhere.

Never said that.

So those that hold the money control the pastor? That's pretty twisted. I don't think God is pleased with that perspective.

Even if the pastor is wrong, it would be wrong for me to defy the leadership. Better to find somewhere else to attend, and make sure things are right between me and God, than to put myself in the dangerous position of trying to pull down or overthrow church leaders.

David's response to Saul in the cave is a prime example of what our attitude should be.

You'd be surprised how often this happens. People here fail to tell of how preacher and their famiies have been done dirty by so called saints.

I could tell you horror stories about that,

Does that mean that most saints are terrible, horrible, controlling people . No

I must amen this

Goodness, I need to go back to bed and get up again. We've agreed twice this morning already. :heeheehee

I remember a young leader in the church feeling a call to start a new church. The pastor told him it was NOT God's will! When he left to start the church anyways, the Pastor lambasted him and his wife from the pulpit!

Within 5 years, this young preacher had a church that was twice the attendance of the original church!

Well I neve said that. But it's always the saints that need to leave.

I left a church I'd been a part of leadership for over twenty years. Going thru old tax records i was shiocked at my investment there. Tithes and offerings into 6 figures. i'd sold a house and donated to help get us into a new building.

Each week I worked many hours. I was involved in just about every department in some way.

But when it's time for someone to go....it's always the saint.

I am glad I left when I did 16 years ago.

That church today has been thru so much upheaval. In a building program that they don't need to be in with another new pastor.

I heard from some of my relatives there that the former pastors teaching of giving 20% tithe /offering has been resurrected and stongly suggested that all should do.

Nope, it always the saints...never the pastor, when church problems arise.

Today,I love my pastor :friend we are fellow labors together in the work of God.