EXCLUSIVE!~ Thoughts on Res.4 from Ohio District Supt. Mark Jordon!
 

*** Thoughts on resolution 4 By Rev. MARK JORDON ***



I have been both troubled and relieved at the general reaction to the passing of Resolution #4 at the General Conference. As many ministers know by now, there is a meeting planned in Tulsa, OK at the end of January, ostensibly for those who no longer feel comfortable fellowshipping with UPCI ministers. The grapevine has it that the attendees have plans to begin a new fellowship in order to determine a “preferred” Apostolic future. Some have projected an attendance of 2000 ministers. If so, it would be a huge gathering of ministers for almost any meeting in oneness history. The General Conference has reached that number only on rare occasions. Because of the Times, in Alexandria, has drawn about 2500 ministers plus spouses in the past. BOTT is probably the biggest ministerial conference going in our ranks, with exception of the GC. I have received two mailouts on this meeting, and, interestingly enough, I would guesstimate that they got their mailing list from—-where else?—-the UPCI!

Two letters have been sent out from ministers who have taken great offense at the passing of the resolution. I’m not sure how many others they officially represent, but I’m sure they express the feelings of many preachers. Neither of them said that they would leave the UPCI. As of this moment, I am only aware of one minister who has terminated his fellowship over this issue.


One of the most vocal opponents of the resolution, J. R. Ensey, editor of the “Minister’s Library” magazine, wrote only a very brief response in his latest issue. It was a non-committal, “wait-and-see” article. Bro. Mark Parker wrote a letter that he sent out on the Internet which appealed to those who were considering a radical response to the resolution. He urged them to remain in fellowship with the organization, reasoning that this would not have a major affect on us as a whole. No one who has a conviction against the use of television for advertising purposes would be forced to violate their position. It was an excellent, balanced letter.

I think that, in the end, few ministers and churches will advertise on television anyway. Many in rural areas don’t have a real need to use this medium, and others may not have the capability to produce a product that could use with confidence. I predict that only 1-2% of our constituency will use television advertising in the near future. Yet, even that small percentage may see results that will make the resolution worth it. Some will reach literally millions of viewers. If someone gets saved as a result of an ad they saw on tv, who among us can speak against their salvation? They will be eternally grateful for someone who reached them with the gospel.

The UPCI needs a balanced constituency. I have many friends who are on the other side of the issue. I love them all and I want them to know that we need them to stay with us. There will be many more challenges in the future that will call for their expressions and convictions to keep us on the straight and narrow. Actually, I am on the same page with them on almost every other issue. What a shame to part company over something that may be so insignificant at this. Some say it is the straw that broke the camel’s back. If it was, it was truly a “straw” in every sense of the word—lightweight, insignificant, of little consequence. I also wonder where the bulk of the weight came from before the straw hit?

For anyone who contemplates leaving the UPCI, I think it would be a mistake of gargantuan proportions. First, after the tv advertising issue is no longer viable, what other issues will be front and center? Will the new fellowship draft a new charter or manual? Where will it start and what will be its priorities? I dare say that many will find themselves at odds with their fellow ministers on points that were never before considered. A large organization like the UPCI has benefits and advantages that will be a long time coming to a start-up group. If such a move were necessary because of heresy or some extreme issue, then one would simply have to bite the bullet and leave. This issue, however, provides no such compelling reasons. In fact, some ministers have been advertising on television for years. Nothing was ever done about it, but neither has there been anyone stepping forward to claim damages. This entire protest movement has begun to look more and more like it was manufactured. One prominent minister has actually stated that resolution #4 was not the real reason for the pull-out. As for me, I think that in this day and age when the coming of the Lord is so imminent, a political squabble is exactly what we don’t need. It will cause a distraction from the real business of the kingdom at a critical time in spiritual history.


Anyway, that’s my take.

-JMJ
11/08/2007






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My district sup can beat up your district sup...lol
This is one of the reasons why Ohio Rocks...tv

TV, all this time we've both been members of the forum and i never knew you was UPC !

"...I am only aware of one minister who has terminated his fellowship over this issue..."

So we send out a mass letter/e-mail just because one minister has left??? Couldn't he have just written to the one brother??????



Keep your hand on the plow
and go forward in a
Straightline

He wanted to be sure he gave his warning of making a mistake of gargantuan proportions for those considering leaving the UPC.

I think some of what he said makes sense.

I wonder what the next hotbutton for the UPC will be?

I agree with you.

In defense of the anti #4 group, they foresee the continued over-all relaxation of TV in the fellowship due to the passing. I think they are probably right on that part.

Do you see that as being a big deal?

I agree.

The question is this, Is that a bad thing?

I say it don't have to be. If you can control the internet and videos you watch then you can control TV.

Ding, Ding, We have a winner!

I agree. Those afraid of change and who cling to the past are correct that the door is now open to moderation.

The only way for the UPC to maintain the extra biblical corporatre legalism is to enforce strict seperation and the TV stance is one of those matters of seperation.

You pretty much have to demonize everything and make things a matter of absolute abstintion rather than spiritual maurity in choices to maintain the old time Oneness Pentecostal religous sect as it has been.

Very well said. I just experienced this over the weekend in a brief discussion when an in-law made a white-wash comment about dress. Any attempt to add any logic or mature thinking was quickly dismissed as well as myself and another being rudely spoken to by the more spiritual insightful one.

I had this comic book where this little tar baby was magically made into this huge outstretched tar baby in order to scare the bad guys away. Later, the large outstretched tarbaby had begun melting in the sun, and the town was trying to keep it big and scary by propping it up and patching it up with sticks, and hay and whatever else.

The analogy is too funny.


http://www.larry-adams.com/TarBaby.jpg

We certainly don't need this issue or any other that may come about deter us from the main goal that we have and that is to be saved! If the world sees us fighting amongst ourselves then they will look elsewhere for salvation. The Word says that men will know that we are His diciples by the love we have for one another(paraphrased)and I am certain that there will be some love lost over this issue wether anyone will admit it or not. I for one want to be saved! And plan to keep a right spirit come what may. In Christ service j.d.

Blah! blah! Blah!

:donuts

What is the main goal of the UPCI again?

Self-perpetuation of a large political-religious machine?

HangingOut...

Where have you been "hanging out?" For over a decade at least...there has been a steady eroding within our movement on the television issue...it is all past tense now...whether for good or bad...

Perhaps, it wasn't all that important...perhaps, it shouldn't have been an "all consuming" issue after all...and just maybe, we should have remained focused on His call for evangelism...

You said it all. TV is not a good enough reason to leave UPCI. More ministers look at TV than they want to admit. Lets vocus on souls.

Nuff Said...
 

It is ah...er...a...oh it's what Sam said!!!! Can't top that!!!!:yourock

Nuff Said...
 

It's...ah...er...a...what Neckstadt said!

:amen

I see you apparently have no problem with the internet. What is the difference? The TV also has an on/off switch. You ought to also get rid of your internet.

I agree with this statement one hundred percent.

The overall issue isn't about television, advertising, broadcasting our services, the internet, or even personal responsibility (even though the last one is a favorite of mine)...the overall issue is about UNITY.

We've had people beating each other's spiritual brains out over this mess for as long as television has existed. Jesus got onto the Pharisees for overlooking the weightier matters of the law, love, mercy, grace, etc. This is the 21st Century renaming of an old issue. We like to accuse the world of putting new names on old sins...when we in the Apostolic movement do the same thing.

I confronted the UPCI AM Forum members a few weeks ago while they were debating this issue and other issues. They are blind to the fact that UNITY is the real resolution...but you don't see anyone from either camp drafting an emergency resolution for that, do we?

A post on their forum to discuss the "new organization" was promptly squashed by the admin and deleted. For the most part, names such as "renegades, rebels and rogues" seems to be the order of the day.

What we need to understand is that there are great men of God on both sides of this issue. I had a pastor tell me last week that God "got rid" of a cancer in the UPC body. How insulting! We've now come to calling men and women of God, souls for whom Christ died...a cancer! Of course we've been calling anybody that doesn't believe exactly as we do the same way for years, so what is amazing about that?

He was totally afronted when I told him that they still have a cancer and that if we don't learn the lessons about loving our brother and sister, no matter about minor issues, God will send a storm among us to keep dividing us until we learn to unify and love our brother. He resoundingly told me I was wrong and that the organization had learned it's lesson about unity. I beg to differ. The cancer wasn't the TV issue. The cancer is a lack of love and unity. God is going to teach us all a harsh lesson on this before long...no matter the organizational name over the door. The time has come for all of us to come together as oneness believers. The pull of the Spirit is to labor together.

Considering a very well known evangelist confronted me on another forum last year, telling me the UPCI would not split, I think current circumstances showed the truth in the matter. I don't keep my ear plugged into the politics of the movement. I try to keep my nose planted on the carpet and wait until God talks to me.

I bear no malice to either side. I was out of church for a decade, running from the call of God on my life and past failures. I don't hate any organization. I've friends in most of them. I'm conservative, yet I work in the visual information field, supervising photography, video, graphics and tv production for a government agency. Can it work? Yes. Do we need it? Some metro areas do. Will it make some of our people compromise their stance on television? Too late for that.

My favorite former pastor commented on this several years ago, stating that what we attempted to do has not worked. Approximately 90% of our people have a television, watch it on a daily basis and are addicted to it. We did the wrong thing by not teaching them to make Holy Ghost-led decisions in their lives and walks with God about what they should and should not watch. Don't say it can't be done...or unplug your computer and shut off your internet service when you do.

You can't legislate holiness and righteousness by a list of rules and a manual. It has to come from the heart.

UNITY has to come from the heart also.

God bless.

Good post.

WHAT!!!!!!

That can't be a good post, he is UPC. He is evil.!!!!

No good post from evil UPC!!!!!!

geesh...

Great read.

Exactly
 

I do agree! Great post.

I also agree this was an excellent post. It is amazing how "brothers" can overnight become "cancers" when they leave. Libs experienced that phenomena when they left after the affirmation statement in '92 and apparently now the ultra conservatives will bear the same label among some.

Hopefully those labels and strong feelings are limited to just a small number of people though.

Post of the Day. ...of the week. ...of the month. ....of the year.

Whoever wrote this... God bless you. This poster has definitely been with Jesus! I appreacite the words... and I apprecaite the spirit.

'Course I'm not UPC, and I do have a TV, but... when I got it...the very first thing I larned about it was to know HOW to turn it off. And it is the "small still voice" within that tells me WHEN to turn it off.