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-   -   Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin? (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=54591)

Tithesmeister 12-05-2021 03:27 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Brother Nicodemus,

Paul was a craftsman. His craft? Tentmaking.

You don’t learn a craft overnight. It was how he made a living. He was practicing what he was preaching. You see Paul not only made a living making tents, he also preached. He also wrote letters to the churches. In one of those letters he exhorted the leaders of the church at Ephesus to work night and day to support the weak in the church. Here’s where he called for the church leadership to meet him at Miletus.

Acts 20
[17] And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church.

Did you understand that? Brother he isn’t teaching that they should be supported by the church, but that they should support the weak in the church. The very opposite of what you teach. Here’s the scripture.

[33] I have coveted no man's silver, or gold, or apparel.
[34] Yea, ye yourselves know, that these hands have ministered unto my necessities, and to them that were with me.
[35] I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

This is the man that you correctly stated wrote much of the New Testament. You say that there were only two or three verses that identify him as a tentmaker. Do you believe those two or three verses?

How many verses do you require before you accept it as true?

Yet you don’t want to believe he was a part time minister? Brother that is your words. I believe Paul was a full time minister. And a full time tentmaker.

Do you know any mothers that have an occupation?

Do you say that they are a part time mother?

I understand that Paul is a challenge for pastors that pretend that it is impossible to hold a job and be a pastor simultaneously. But if you can read and understand the KJV English, you surely have to admit that Paul did preach and make tents, and write letters to churches, and get arrested, and was shipwrecked, and was imprisoned. It was his life. He preached it and he practiced it.

Edit: By the way EB? Did you notice that there is not one word in this post that means tenth? Not one mention!

Evang.Benincasa 12-05-2021 06:15 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606604)
Brother Nicodemus,

Paul was a craftsman. His craft? Tentmaking.

You don’t learn a craft overnight. It was how he made a living. He was practicing what he was preaching. You see Paul not only made a living making tents, he also preached. He also wrote letters to the churches. In one of those letters he exhorted the leaders of the church at Ephesus to work night and day to support the weak in the church. Here’s where he called for the church leadership to meet him at Miletus.

All that while he was under Roman arrest and being brought to Caesar.

Forget being a full "pastor" which he wasn't. But he was a full time Roman freeborn citizen who was a prisoner. Guarded by at least two to three Roman soldiers. Paul was an apostle, which modern day United States hasn't the foggiest idea what that even entailed. Elders ran the church families sprinkled around Asia Minor. Support would of been through those church families. Paul had people with him at times and it seems that he supported them. using Paul as the model for the modern pastor, isn't a good match.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606604)
Edit: By the way EB? Did you notice that there is not one word in this post that means tenth? Not one mention!

It's like this bro, you don't even have to say tenth, tithe, offering, velvet money sock, golden offering plate, or folded up to the size of a micro dot dollar bill, to know where you are heading.

Listen, my personal opinion is that this was (emphasis on was) an important thread. Hey, I understand you think you got a win. But it's like this, some people tithe, some people give offerings. Bro, you aren't the first guy to preach no tithing on this forum or any other blog, forum or chat room. You know what? People going to still tithe. Maybe you should start a no tithe church. There was a poster by the name of Rudy who was going to move to the location of whoever started the "No Tithe" church. But sad thing is none of the tithe troop wanted to take their show on the road and start a church. But I digress. I said all that to say this, who are you trying to convert? Are you making any headway? Do you tithe in real life?

Tithesmeister 12-06-2021 06:59 AM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 (Post 1606602)
Sorry for falling for the tithe argument, we can continue with the death penalty discussion.

The state of Wisconsin (home of Darrell Brooks Jr.) doesnít have the death penalty. It was abolished in 1853. They are the only state that has only put one person to death ever. It sounds like he will get life in prison. Poor guy.

Nicodemus1968 12-06-2021 08:57 AM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606604)
Brother Nicodemus,

Do you know any mothers that have an occupation?

Do you say that they are a part time mother?

Brother, if the mother is gone for 8 hours a day, who's raising the kids? Because with all due respect, it's not the mom.

I was raised by my grandmother, why because my mom wasn't there. She was gone working, among other things. I have a special bond with my grandmother than I do not have with my mom.

like one song said, "that's just the way it is...."

Nicodemus1968 12-06-2021 09:11 AM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606604)
Brother Nicodemus,

Paul was a craftsman. His craft? Tentmaking.

[I] Rom 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, /I]

1Co 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother

2Co 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)

Eph 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

Php 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Col 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother,

1Th 1:1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

2Th 1:1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ:

1Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;

2Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

Phm 1:1 Paul, a prisoner of Jesus Christ, and Timothy our brother, unto Philemon our dearly beloved, and fellowlabourer,

Not arguing the fact that Paul didn't make tents, yet in my opinion that was way down on the list of what his calling was.

What comes first, the trade or the calling?

Tithesmeister 12-06-2021 11:49 AM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 (Post 1606610)
Brother, if the mother is gone for 8 hours a day, who's raising the kids? Because with all due respect, it's not the mom.

I was raised by my grandmother, why because my mom wasn't there. She was gone working, among other things. I have a special bond with my grandmother than I do not have with my mom.

like one song said, "that's just the way it is...."

I agree with this post more than you know. The truth is that children are raised by the public schools more than the mothers. But most people, even Apostolic people, have their children in public schools. We are just now reaping the rewards of some of that raising. One of the blessings of Covid is that it opened the eyes of the parents to what was really going on.

Thank God for grandmothers.

Tithesmeister 12-06-2021 12:09 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 (Post 1606611)
[I] Rom 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, /I]

1Co 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother

2Co 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)

Eph 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

Php 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Col 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother,

1Th 1:1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

2Th 1:1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ:

1Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;

2Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

Phm 1:1 Paul, a prisoner of Jesus Christ, and Timothy our brother, unto Philemon our dearly beloved, and fellowlabourer,

Not arguing the fact that Paul didn't make tents, yet in my opinion that was way down on the list of what his calling was.

What comes first, the trade or the calling?

I believe Paul used his trade to support his calling. That is my point. If you dig ditches for a living it doesnít mean you quit being a teacher, preacher, church elder, singer, piano player or witness for Jesus Christ.

Occupations are a way to get to talk to people in a way that otherwise may not be available to you. Most sermons are likely not preached in church buildings. My father sang and worked at the same time and he may well preach or witness if he believed it was appropriate. It doesnít mean that he didnít do a good job at both or all four. Does the calling to preach void a man of the ability and talent to drive nails? They are not mutually exclusive.

I do agree that the Bible is not only for the preachers to obey. It is for the church, which includes the preachers.

Aaaand I love you Brother. I sincerely hope you donít believe otherwise. Because I tell you the truth, not because I DONíT love you, but I tell you the truth and back it with scripture because I do.

Otherwise I wouldnít bother. Or as Paul the tentmaker would put it . . .

Gal.4

[16] Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Nicodemus1968 12-06-2021 12:12 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606616)
I believe Paul used his trade to support his calling. That is my point. If you dig ditches for a living it doesnít mean you quit being a teacher, preacher, church elder, singer, piano player or witness for Jesus Christ.

Occupations are a way to get to talk to people in a way that otherwise may not be available to you. Most sermons are likely not preached in church buildings. My father sang and worked at the same time and he may well preach or witness if he believed it was appropriate. It doesnít mean that he didnít do a good job at both or all four. Does the calling to preach void a man of the ability and talent to drive nails? They are not mutually exclusive.

I do agree that the Bible is not only for the preachers to obey. It is for the church, which includes the preachers.

Aaaand I love you Brother. I sincerely hope you donít believe otherwise. Because I tell you the truth, not because I DONíT love you, but I tell you the truth and back it with scripture because I do.

Otherwise I wouldnít bother. Or as Paul the tentmaker would put it . . .

Gal.4

[16] Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

I agree with that. For what itís worth.

Nicodemus1968 12-06-2021 12:14 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606615)
I agree with this post more than you know. The truth is that children are raised by the public schools more than the mothers. But most people, even Apostolic people, have their children in public schools. We are just now reaping the rewards of some of that raising. One of the blessings of Covid is that it opened the eyes of the parents to what was really going on.

Thank God for grandmothers.

That is the gospel truth.

Evang.Benincasa 12-06-2021 02:54 PM

Re: Car Crashes Through a Parade in Wisconsin?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister (Post 1606616)
I believe Paul used his trade to support his calling. That is my point. If you dig ditches for a living it doesn’t mean you quit being a teacher, preacher, church elder, singer, piano player or witness for Jesus Christ.

Occupations are a way to get to talk to people in a way that otherwise may not be available to you. Most sermons are likely not preached in church buildings. My father sang and worked at the same time and he may well preach or witness if he believed it was appropriate. It doesn’t mean that he didn’t do a good job at both or all four. Does the calling to preach void a man of the ability and talent to drive nails? They are not mutually exclusive.

I do agree that the Bible is not only for the preachers to obey. It is for the church, which includes the preachers.

Aaaand I love you Brother. I sincerely hope you don’t believe otherwise. Because I tell you the truth, not because I DON’T love you, but I tell you the truth and back it with scripture because I do.

Otherwise I wouldn’t bother. Or as Paul the tentmaker would put it . . .

Gal.4

[16] Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Hey, have you ever started a church? Ever had a church family which you were the leadership? Talk about Jesus on the job? That really depends on what kind of job who have. Paul lived in a Theocracy, run by a priesthood. That priesthood was controlled by the ruling elite of his time and the Roman politico. Paul speaking about Jesus wasn't while he was stitching and sewing. We read that he was preaching and teaching in the Judean places of worship. But again, have you ever started a church?


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