My purpose on here
 

Hello everyone,

Think you for taking the time to read this. What I'm seeking to discuss is the possibilities of God having 'parts'.

Some general statements:
1. I don't believe that salvation is dependent on understanding this.
2. I believe that the conclusions/actions that are taken are what are ultimately important (i.e. baptism in Jesus name)
3. I believe 'modalism' is an adequate representation of God even though I don't think it is the best. I have no problem with people that believe such.
4. I desire a continual growth in God - even at the expense of my comfort.
5. I'm unsure of where exactly I should post my thoughts since I'm not looking for debate just help. 'Deep waters' seemed the best bet... Suggestions

God bless

Re: My purpose on here
 

Some further thoughts to consider...

As of now I believe:
0. God is one unchanging WHO (not a WHAT). What HE was at any one time HE always is.
1. That the Son (a human consciousness) existed in eternity past as a person distinct in God.
2. I believe the Son is part of the Father.
3. I believe that we can become part of the Father - aka 'adopted'.
4. God (aka the Father) is not a person, even though HE has personal attributes.
5. I refer to God as a PERSON along the lines of the OT 'LORD'.

A little about me:
I attend an UPC church. I've grown up in the faith (gnawing on pews :) ). Up until the last eight months, if I had to I probably would've called myself a modalist (didn't know the term though then).

God bless

Re: My purpose on here
 

why do you believe the son(human consciousness) existed in eternity past distinct from God?

Re: My purpose on here
 

Hello DM,
Thanks for biting :)
Actually, I said 'distinct in God' and not 'distinct from God'. 'From' (at least to me) shows an existance apart from God while 'in' shows an existance as part of God.
As to why He existed in eternity past is that God is unchanging. If HE has parts, those parts are unchanging. If God existed in eternity past then HIS parts existed in eternity past. If the Son (the human consciousness) is part of God then He also existed in eternity past.

The is what is up for discussion though. Can the human consciousness that we call the man Jesus be part of God? I think so but I'm wondering if others will see it the same way. I'm wondering if anyone knows any Scripture that 'prevents' God having parts. If there isn't any then I don't see how this can't be a valid understanding of God's nature...

I use the word 'distinct' because there has to be a difference between Father and Son of some sort. Gotta go though but I look forward to your thoughts...

God bless

Re: My purpose on here
 

I'm having trouble with your use of the term parts. The bible says God is one, also that God is spirit. I don't see any parts in eternity past or when Christ was on earth. Explain what you mean by parts. I don't think the incarnation is a distinct part of God, just as much as all of creation is part of God. In him we live and move and have our being. Acts 17.

Re: My purpose on here
 

Yes there are two parts to God.

a. The omnipresent Holy Spirit which is bigger than all things in the universe.

b. His visible image. The Angel of YHWH in the Old Testament the Son of God in the New.

Re: My purpose on here
 

Hello DM,
Quite a few people do :)
True and true again...
Can't think of any witty banter here. :)
Something to consider though: can a truly INFINITE God fit into a finite vessel? To me that would make a mockery of the words 'infinite' and 'finite' if HE could.
These definitions are taken from dictionary.com
1. a portion or division of a whole that is separate or distinct; piece, fragment, fraction, or section; constituent
2. an essential or integral attribute or quality
- Basically, there's a distinction between Father in Son. Then there's a verse that says the Son is in the Father. So I suggest that the Son is distinct within the Father. This fulfills the criteria of #1 definition of part.
- Is the Son essential? Is His humanity? I say yes. Being yes, this fulfills the #2 definition of part.
- The thing that binds this all together is that fact that God (and Jesus Christ) doesn't change. If something was ever once part of God then it was always part of God.
The incarnation was when God (or from my perspective 'part of God') took on flesh. The flesh is distinct from the soul/spirit that resides within it. incarnation = body = not part of God = can change. His body was created while His human soul (to me of course) always existed as part of HIM.

Hopes this helps some. Looking forward to your response.

God bless

Re: My purpose on here
 

Can there be a "portion" of God?

Yes.

8: With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses? Numbers 12:8

The word similitude is in the Hebrew "something portioned" according to Strongs Concordance.

Re: My purpose on here
 

If by "parts of God" you refer to body, soul and spirit of God then I agree with you. I believe that God the Father is spirit. The soul of God is the holy spirit or word and the body of God is the son. I'm not sure "parts" is the best term since body, soul and spirit are one person, but I can agree with you if that's what you mean by parts of one person. I don't believe the son can exist without soul or spirit of the holyghost/word and father. So son is a part of God but not independent of God, but a intergral part of God. The body did not preexist, but the soul as the word did and is also a part of the spirit.

Re: My purpose on here
 

Hello Michael,
Thank you. Interesting verse there. I like looking at Philippians 2:6 - 'form'
-from strongs-
morphe (G3444)
Perhaps from the base of G3313 (through the idea of adjustment of parts); shape; figuratively nature: - form.
meros (G3313)
From an obsolete but more primary form of μείρομαι meiromai (to get as a section or allotment); a division or share (literally or figuratively, in a wide application): - behalf, coast, course, craft, particular (+ -ly), part (+ -ly), piece, portion, respect, side, some sort (-what).

So with this I see 2:6 easily reading 'Who, being part of God...'

Thanks again

God bless