Originally Posted by CC1 (Post 1310521)

I know there is a sub section for WPF news on this forum but since this main area is where the vast majority of people are I wanted to post this thread here.

Now that the Worldwide Wrestling Pentecostal Fellowship has been active for a few years do some of you folks in the know have an update for us?

What happened after the UPCI drew the line in the sand and said that ministers could not be licensed with the UPC and be a member of WPF? We know what happened in the short term. That some of the UPC preachers heavily invested in the formation of the WPF left the UPC but now that the dust has settled what has happened over time?

While the UPCI General Board did pass a resolution which "drew a line in the sand" so to speak, they left the implementation and enforcement up to the districts. As of this date (as far as I am aware) NO district has taken action to force any minister to "draw the line." IMHO this was wisdom on their part....making people choose would have caused a greater exodus....JMO.

Specifically here are some questions I have if anyone has the answers;

1. How many members does the WPF have and how many licensed ministers?
The UPC lost several hundred ministers in the immediate aftermath of the infamous Tampa TV resolution. Not all of them joined the WPF....in fact many of them simply became independents. The WPF has approx. 500 members in the US, and is steadily growing. Internationally, they have several thousand

2. In the time since it was formed what has been the ebb and flow of WPF membership? Are more licensed ministers leaving the UPC for the WPF or is there a pattern of WPF ministers moving back to the UPC?
The WPF has grown steadily......Their membership does not just reflect current/ex-UPC ministers but is a representation of a broad spectrum of OP ministries. They really do have members from several different organizations and independents as well. I am sure that there are some who have moved both ways.....UPC to WPF and WPF to UPC.

3. Are some ministers having it both ways by retaining their license with the UPC but fellowshipping at WPF conferences / meetings because the people are more "holy" (not my term)?
First the WPF allows anyone to fellowship/attend their meetings regardless of affiliation/membership. They have (many times) given offerings to missionaries (both home/foreign) regardless of their affiliation. So, the answer is two fold....there are MANY UPC/other OP org ministers that attend the WPF meetings and enjoy the fellowship with NO intention of ever joining the WPF....and there are men who are licensed members of the UPCI who are members of the WPF.

4. Last but not least if any AFF folks are involved with the WPF can you just give us a general update on what is happening within this ultra conservative organization? (yes you are "ultra conservative" when you think the UPC is liberal!)
The WPF still does not license/ordain ministers. (This is different in some areas such as a few foreign countries where licensing is necessary) The ideology of the WPF is that licensing/ordination is the right of the local church NOT and organization.

While may believed/still believe the WPF framers were power hungry, bitter old men who didn't get what they wanted so they left.....the fact is the WPF probably has the least political and most biblical method of choosing its leaders. They put all of the qualified names in a hat, pray over them, and then pull out a name.....kind of removes the whole campaigning element.

Also the WPF has morphed into a full fledged organization. I do NOT believe that was the original plan. I stand firm on that because I have personally sat down with those founders and have heard first hand what their vision was. They envisioned a fellowship where any conservative OP could stay in their respective org and still come together for fellowship. However, as they grew many of the men who came on board were used to the structure of an org and began to ask for more and more structure. It is still very light on structure and each church is truly autonomous.

Their meetings are well attended with MANY attendees being non-members. (For example, their annual you convention in Tulsa.....some estimate that nearly half of the attendees are UPC.) Incidentally, they use WPF, UPC, Independent, ministers to preach nearly all of their events. It really is NOT about your card/affiliation but what you believe/preach/practice.

Originally Posted by bishoph (Post 1310638)

The WPF still does not license/ordain ministers. (This is different in some areas such as a few foreign countries where licensing is necessary) The ideology of the WPF is that licensing/ordination is the right of the local church NOT and organization.

Their meetings are well attended with MANY attendees being non-members. (For example, their annual you convention in Tulsa.....some estimate that nearly half of the attendees are UPC.) Incidentally, they use WPF, UPC, Independent, ministers to preach nearly all of their events. It really is NOT about your card/affiliation but what you believe/preach/practice.

Originally Posted by bishoph (Post 1310638)

My answers in red....I am NOT in any way a spokesman for the WPF, however, I do have family who are members and I do attend some of their meetings each year. Are there members who make them look bad....I'm sure there are, just as there are in any group. But for the most part what I have observed are people who love God and their brethren regardless of what card you carry. Oh.....and just in case you want to know.....I have NEVER heard any UPC bashing at ANY meeting I have ever been to. (And I have been to quite a few)

Originally Posted by bishoph (Post 1310638)

My answers in red....I am NOT in any way a spokesman for the WPF, however, I do have family who are members and I do attend some of their meetings each year. Are there members who make them look bad....I'm sure there are, just as there are in any group. But for the most part what I have observed are people who love God and their brethren regardless of what card you carry. Oh.....and just in case you want to know.....I have NEVER heard any UPC bashing at ANY meeting I have ever been to. (And I have been to quite a few)

Originally Posted by Carl (Post 1310660)

What is the GIB? Also what is the organization in the southwest that left the UPCI in the nineties?