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thephnxman 09-18-2015 10:47 AM
Called to the ministry
 
In the Service of Men

The Ministry cannot be attained with much secular preparation and studies: nor can
an office be achieved by the mere ordination of men. The result would be a creation
of a system that is politically influenced. Such was the case when the Son of God
entered the scene and began his ministry. Men like Caiaphas and Anas (one a a high
priest, and both men of great influence during that time) would exchange the most
prestigious roles to retain the power and authority among the Pharisees and Council.

God had not spoken by the prophets and the Levitical priesthood for more than 400
years. Consequently, it was impossible for the Jewish leaders to be sensitive to the
Voice of God. They had become so spiritually deteriorated, that their future leaders
would be chosen solely by their demonstrable service and visible obedience to the
religious system at the time. History tells us that that system was filled with corruption
and selfish interests among both groups and individuals. It was, I may add, a mirror
image of of what we see today.

"And He gave some, apostles; and some, prophets..."

KeptByTheWord 09-18-2015 11:00 AM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Luke 22:25-27

25 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.

26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

27 For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.
May all those who are in leadership/ministry positions remember that the heart must desire to be as Jesus, who was a servant to all. Any other kind of leadership will not produce results for the kingdom of God without that kind of heart. A man's kingdom on earth may be propped up... but the true kingdom of God will only be built by those who are willing to follow the example of our Lord Jesus Christ... who was a servant to all.

BrotherEastman 09-18-2015 11:20 AM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thephnxman (Post 1392227)
In the Service of Men

The Ministry cannot be attained with much secular preparation and studies: nor can
an office be achieved by the mere ordination of men. The result would be a creation
of a system that is politically influenced. Such was the case when the Son of God
entered the scene and began his ministry. Men like Caiaphas and Anas (one a a high
priest, and both men of great influence during that time) would exchange the most
prestigious roles to retain the power and authority among the Pharisees and Council.

God had not spoken by the prophets and the Levitical priesthood for more than 400
years. Consequently, it was impossible for the Jewish leaders to be sensitive to the
Voice of God. They had become so spiritually deteriorated, that their future leaders
would be chosen solely by their demonstrable service and visible obedience to the
religious system at the time. History tells us that that system was filled with corruption
and selfish interests among both groups and individuals. It was, I may add, a mirror
image of of what we see today.

"And He gave some, apostles; and some, prophets..."
I promise that these are questions out of curiosity and not that of a debate. I may have other questions to clarify some points, but I promise I am only trying to understand your view. Who are the modern day apostles and how did they come to be?

KeptByTheWord 09-18-2015 11:27 AM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman (Post 1392237)
I promise that these are questions out of curiosity and not that of a debate. I may have other questions to clarify some points, but I promise I am only trying to understand your view. Who are the modern day apostles and how did they come to be?
I too, had the same question, just this morning! I was reading in 1 Cor. 15.

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:

6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.

8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.


It seems that Paul is saying that the apostles were those who seen Jesus Christ, and that he was the last one who saw Him?

BrotherEastman 09-18-2015 01:02 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord (Post 1392241)
I too, had the same question, just this morning! I was reading in 1 Cor. 15.

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:

6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.

8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.


It seems that Paul is saying that the apostles were those who seen Jesus Christ, and that he was the last one who saw Him?
This leads me to another question; if what you are saying is indicative of those who actually saw and/or walked with Christ then who are the apostles today that received this special office/title?

BrotherEastman 09-18-2015 01:10 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord (Post 1392241)
I too, had the same question, just this morning! I was reading in 1 Cor. 15.

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:

6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.

8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.


It seems that Paul is saying that the apostles were those who seen Jesus Christ, and that he was the last one who saw Him?
Sorry, I just had another thought on this matter. Isn't it entirely possible that the writings of the New Testament is still a perpetual gift of the apostleship? I'm just thinking while I am talking/writing this out.

thephnxman 09-18-2015 01:51 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by [B
BrotherEastman[/B];1392237]
I promise that these are questions out of curiosity and not that of a debate. I may have other questions to clarify some points, but I promise I am only trying to understand your view. Who are the modern day apostles and how did they come to be?
Modern day, but NOT modernized apostles. They come to be the same way Saul
of Tarsus came to be an apostle. They first believed and obeyed; preached what they
believed; were called into the Ministry (Saul was a teacher); and then the Lord SENT
them forth "...for the work whereunto I have called them."

Quote:
Originally Posted by [B
KeptByTheWord[/B];1392241]
I too, had the same question, just this morning! I was reading in 1 Cor. 15.
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received,
7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.

It seems that Paul is saying that the apostles were those who seen Jesus Christ, and that he was the last one who saw Him?
Paul did not say he was the LAST of the apostles; rather, that he was lastly called,
and SENT from Antioch. I believe that Barnabas was also an apostle, seeing he was
called and sent WITH Paul. Now both Barnabas and Paul were already in the
Ministry: Barnabas was a prophet; Paul, a teacher. Where is the apostle today?
Ask those who have usurped the Ministry and converted it into a one-man show by
saying that the other offices (prophet, evangelist, and teacher) are subject to them.
And the office of the apostle? Has been completely ignored.

(Incidentally: I don't claim to be an apostle or prophet.)

Beloved, those are some of my views concerning the Office of Apostle. However,
the thread is regarding the calling into the Ministry.

BrotherEastman 09-18-2015 02:36 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thephnxman (Post 1392280)
Modern day, but NOT modernized apostles. They come to be the same way Saul
of Tarsus came to be an apostle. They first believed and obeyed; preached what they
believed; were called into the Ministry (Saul was a teacher); and then the Lord SENT
them forth "...for the work whereunto I have called them."



Paul did not say he was the LAST of the apostles; rather, that he was lastly called,
and SENT from Antioch. I believe that Barnabas was also an apostle, seeing he was
called and sent WITH Paul. Now both Barnabas and Paul were already in the
Ministry: Barnabas was a prophet; Paul, a teacher. Where is the apostle today?
Ask those who have usurped the Ministry and converted it into a one-man show by
saying that the other offices (prophet, evangelist, and teacher) are subject to them.
And the office of the apostle? Has been completely ignored.

(Incidentally: I don't claim to be an apostle or prophet.)

Beloved, those are some of my views concerning the Office of Apostle. However,
the thread is regarding the calling into the Ministry.
Thank you for your response. Being called into the ministry; does that have anything to do with be "activated" by another apostle? Or do we inherently know that we are called by God to be in the ministry and God himself makes a way for our ministry?

shazeep 09-18-2015 03:16 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord (Post 1392241)
7 After that, he was seen of James; then of [big]ALL[/big] the apostles.
seems pretty clear to me; but there are people who "seed" churches, i guess, that are sometimes (heretically, imo) called Apostles, i guess.

KeptByTheWord 09-18-2015 06:46 PM
Re: Called to the ministry
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman (Post 1392265)
This leads me to another question; if what you are saying is indicative of those who actually saw and/or walked with Christ then who are the apostles today that received this special office/title?
I don't know. I don't want to take on the job of saying the ministry of the apostles ended with Paul... but it certainly seems in that passage that he is saying he was the last of the apostles.


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