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-   -   Bethel Music (Redding) (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=54988)

diakonos 07-13-2024 01:09 AM
Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Would you attend a church that sings Bethel songs?

Amanah 07-13-2024 04:58 AM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Maybe, depends

For instance, I really like this song:

https://youtu.be/n0FBb6hnwTo?si=mBNyyjZfH3rhXxOT

I love You, Lord
Oh, your mercy never failed me
All my days, I've been held in your hands
From the moment that i wake up
Until i lay my head
Oh, i will sing of the goodness of God
And all my life you have been faithful
And all my life you have been so, so good
With every breath that i am able
Oh, i will sing of the goodness of God
I love your voice
You have led me through the fire
And in darkest night you are close like no other
I've known you as a Father
I've known you as a Friend
And i have lived in the goodness of God, yeah
And all my life you have been faithful, oh-oh-oh
And all my life you have been so, so good
With every breath that i am able
Oh, i will sing of the goodness of God, yeah
'Cause your goodness is running after, it's running after me
Your goodness is running after, it's running after me
With my life laid down, i'm surrendered now
I give you everything
'Cause your goodness is running after, it's running after me, oh-oh
'Cause your goodness is running after, it's running after me
Your goodness is running after, it's running after me
With my life laid down, i'm surrendered now
I give you everything
'Cause your goodness is running after, it keeps running after me
And all my life you have been faithful
And all my life you have been so, so good
With every breath that i am able
Oh, i'm gonna sing of the goodness of God
I'm gonna sing, i'm gonna sing
'Cause all my life you have been faithful
And all my life you have been so, so good
With every breath that i am able
Oh, i'm gonna sing of the goodness of God
Oh, i'm gonna sing of the goodness of God

Amanah 07-13-2024 06:08 AM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
However, some potential interpretive differences with Bible doctrine include:

- The emphasis on God's goodness "running after" the speaker might be seen as contradicting the idea that God's goodness is already present and available (Romans 8:38-39)
- The repeated focus on personal experience and emotions might lead some to prioritize individual feelings over objective biblical truth

Nicodemus1968 07-14-2024 10:10 AM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by diakonos (Post 1615651)
Would you attend a church that sings Bethel songs?
What about a church that sings Hank Williams?

Evang.Benincasa 07-14-2024 02:29 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 (Post 1615689)
What about a church that sings Hank Williams?
How about churches that don’t sing?

Nicodemus1968 07-14-2024 03:22 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa (Post 1615690)
How about churches that don’t sing?
Hahaha!

Esaias 07-14-2024 04:12 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
The problem I have with most "contemporary Christian worship music", and a lot of "not so contemporary Christian worship music", is that the purpose of the music is not Scriptural.

The modern charismatic idea is that through the right music performed magnificently ("anointedly") the musicians "usher the worshippers into the presence of God", or else they "bring the presence of God into the meeting" or something.

Pentecost has picked up this idea in a lot of ways. In fact, it's beginnings were complained about by none other than Frank Bartleman in his record of Azusa Street, when he complained about service leaders were trying to "jazz the people up" through music (and other means) into a false spiritual experience. And of course this goes back to the Catholic and monastic ideas that music is a tool to guide the psychological state of the worshippers into a religious experience. Which in turn is standard paganism.

It is without any dispute that music has a psychological and emotional effect on people. Indeed it has a spiritual effect on people. But the idea that God wants us to use music to hype ourselves into an "experience" is simply not Biblical, and not apostolic.

It's no different than the "altar call music" where the altar call is given and the pianist or organist or whoever begins playing or singing that sad sad tune to tug at the heart strings of the audience.

Something isn't right with that.

Colossians 3:16 KJV
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

The purpose of singing in church is to teach and admonish one another. Worship music is supposed to be doctrinal and instructive, it is not supposed to be sappy and primarily emotional. Of course this doesn't mean it should be dry and devoid of feeling, but the feeling should be that which would naturally accompany the IDEAS expressed by the music.

You know how one preacher can preach with feeling and emotion, and the feeling and passion etc is a RESULT of the message he is delivering? And another preach can preach with "feeling and emotion", and the feeling and emotion are the POINT and PURPOSE of the message? You know what I am talking about if you have been in Christ for any length of time. There is a difference between genuine feeling that corresponds to the situation on the one hand, and an affected, hyped up, imposed feeling that is there just for its own sake.

Or like when maybe the drummer is missing from the worship team one day, and for whatever reason the church just can't "get into it" that day? Showing that the church isn't getting into Jesus but is rather getting into the beat and the music.

Modern worship music tends to be very sparse when it comes to any kind of doctrine or admonition. It tends to be almost entirely love-music, "Jesus is my boyfriend" type of music. It is effeminate and appeals to the feminine, which is probably why men seem to be dropping out of church more and more as time goes on. Modern western "church" is becoming an emotional catharsis for neurotic women, by and large. The men who remain are becoming more and more effeminate, and more and more they seem to have fewer and fewer clues about what genuine Biblical masculinity is about.

There is nothing wrong with expressing feeling for the Lord. If you don't have any feeling for the Lord I would question if you are saved at all. But Jesus is not my boyfriend. He's my King, my God, my Father, my Redeemer.

Our music should reflect that.

Tithesmeister 07-14-2024 05:56 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias (Post 1615693)
The problem I have with most "contemporary Christian worship music", and a lot of "not so contemporary Christian worship music", is that the purpose of the music is not Scriptural.

The modern charismatic idea is that through the right music performed magnificently ("anointedly") the musicians "usher the worshippers into the presence of God", or else they "bring the presence of God into the meeting" or something.

Pentecost has picked up this idea in a lot of ways. In fact, it's beginnings were complained about by none other than Frank Bartleman in his record of Azusa Street, when he complained about service leaders were trying to "jazz the people up" through music (and other means) into a false spiritual experience. And of course this goes back to the Catholic and monastic ideas that music is a tool to guide the psychological state of the worshippers into a religious experience. Which in turn is standard paganism.

It is without any dispute that music has a psychological and emotional effect on people. Indeed it has a spiritual effect on people. But the idea that God wants us to use music to hype ourselves into an "experience" is simply not Biblical, and not apostolic.

It's no different than the "altar call music" where the altar call is given and the pianist or organist or whoever begins playing or singing that sad sad tune to tug at the heart strings of the audience.

Something isn't right with that.

Colossians 3:16 KJV
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

The purpose of singing in church is to teach and admonish one another. Worship music is supposed to be doctrinal and instructive, it is not supposed to be sappy and primarily emotional. Of course this doesn't mean it should be dry and devoid of feeling, but the feeling should be that which would naturally accompany the IDEAS expressed by the music.

You know how one preacher can preach with feeling and emotion, and the feeling and passion etc is a RESULT of the message he is delivering? And another preach can preach with "feeling and emotion", and the feeling and emotion are the POINT and PURPOSE of the message? You know what I am talking about if you have been in Christ for any length of time. There is a difference between genuine feeling that corresponds to the situation on the one hand, and an affected, hyped up, imposed feeling that is there just for its own sake.

Or like when maybe the drummer is missing from the worship team one day, and for whatever reason the church just can't "get into it" that day? Showing that the church isn't getting into Jesus but is rather getting into the beat and the music.

Modern worship music tends to be very sparse when it comes to any kind of doctrine or admonition. It tends to be almost entirely love-music, "Jesus is my boyfriend" type of music. It is effeminate and appeals to the feminine, which is probably why men seem to be dropping out of church more and more as time goes on. Modern western "church" is becoming an emotional catharsis for neurotic women, by and large. The men who remain are becoming more and more effeminate, and more and more they seem to have fewer and fewer clues about what genuine Biblical masculinity is about.

There is nothing wrong with expressing feeling for the Lord. If you don't have any feeling for the Lord I would question if you are saved at all. But Jesus is not my boyfriend. He's my King, my God, my Father, my Redeemer.

Our music should reflect that.
Right on!
:highfive

Evang.Benincasa 07-14-2024 08:26 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias (Post 1615693)
The problem I have with most "contemporary Christian worship music", and a lot of "not so contemporary Christian worship music", is that the purpose of the music is not Scriptural.

The modern charismatic idea is that through the right music performed magnificently ("anointedly") the musicians "usher the worshippers into the presence of God", or else they "bring the presence of God into the meeting" or something.

Pentecost has picked up this idea in a lot of ways. In fact, it's beginnings were complained about by none other than Frank Bartleman in his record of Azusa Street, when he complained about service leaders were trying to "jazz the people up" through music (and other means) into a false spiritual experience. And of course this goes back to the Catholic and monastic ideas that music is a tool to guide the psychological state of the worshippers into a religious experience. Which in turn is standard paganism.

It is without any dispute that music has a psychological and emotional effect on people. Indeed it has a spiritual effect on people. But the idea that God wants us to use music to hype ourselves into an "experience" is simply not Biblical, and not apostolic.

It's no different than the "altar call music" where the altar call is given and the pianist or organist or whoever begins playing or singing that sad sad tune to tug at the heart strings of the audience.

Something isn't right with that.

Colossians 3:16 KJV
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

The purpose of singing in church is to teach and admonish one another. Worship music is supposed to be doctrinal and instructive, it is not supposed to be sappy and primarily emotional. Of course this doesn't mean it should be dry and devoid of feeling, but the feeling should be that which would naturally accompany the IDEAS expressed by the music.

You know how one preacher can preach with feeling and emotion, and the feeling and passion etc is a RESULT of the message he is delivering? And another preach can preach with "feeling and emotion", and the feeling and emotion are the POINT and PURPOSE of the message? You know what I am talking about if you have been in Christ for any length of time. There is a difference between genuine feeling that corresponds to the situation on the one hand, and an affected, hyped up, imposed feeling that is there just for its own sake.

Or like when maybe the drummer is missing from the worship team one day, and for whatever reason the church just can't "get into it" that day? Showing that the church isn't getting into Jesus but is rather getting into the beat and the music.

Modern worship music tends to be very sparse when it comes to any kind of doctrine or admonition. It tends to be almost entirely love-music, "Jesus is my boyfriend" type of music. It is effeminate and appeals to the feminine, which is probably why men seem to be dropping out of church more and more as time goes on. Modern western "church" is becoming an emotional catharsis for neurotic women, by and large. The men who remain are becoming more and more effeminate, and more and more they seem to have fewer and fewer clues about what genuine Biblical masculinity is about.

There is nothing wrong with expressing feeling for the Lord. If you don't have any feeling for the Lord I would question if you are saved at all. But Jesus is not my boyfriend. He's my King, my God, my Father, my Redeemer.

Our music should reflect that.
Wonderfully powerful.

Excellent 👍🏽

diakonos 07-14-2024 11:18 PM
Re: Bethel Music (Redding)
 
Thanks E,

I’m really sick of the music. Dim lights.


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