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Originally Posted by votivesoul
True enough. But he was at least fallen by the time Job was around. Additionally if the serpent isn't a representation of the dragon, I don't know what is.
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He was definitely fallen before Adam, I believe. I'm just saying that whenever he fell, it is not necessarily the fall we read about in
Revelation 12. Some believe that fall occurs when the beast (not antichrist, since nothing in Revelaiton even hints at what John described as antichrist in
1 John 4) is possessed which is long after the cross. The ONLY pleace we read any hint of one third of the angels falling with the devil is
Rev 12 where one third of the stars were dragged down by his tail. But again,
Rev 12 is not proved to refer to satan's initial fall.
Rev 12 shows satan falling into the earth, whereas before this satan was prince of the air. That seemed to change in
Rev 12.
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And Jesus said this before His passion, indicating that Satan's fall was before the blood atoned for anything, helping to solidfy my point made earlier.
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I totally agree. But I am just saying
Rev 12 is not necessarily THAT fall.
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Just for the record, I don't make that assumption. I'm not convinced that "Lucifer" is Satan.
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I lean toward the thought that it is satan, but it cannot be proved. The common denominator between Christ's words and Isaiah's concerning Lucifer is that both fell from heaven. It could even be that Lucifer was a man but was so perfectly a shadow of satan, too.