Newborns & Children go to hell?! What does the Bib

NewbieMisfits · #1 06-11-2013, 05:41 AM

Soooo.....

Can someone help me out on some scripture here....

1. I was told by an Apo that; if a child, that is not of the age of accountability dies, and their parents were not saved/born-again that this child goes to hell!?!?!

2. Now if the same whom said this doesn't believe in abortion, as they believe life starts at conception, then by their definition they would have to believe an aborted fetus from sinful parents would also go to hell. <<I'm asking this at breakfast this morning<<

If ANYONE could share some scripture on #1 I would be most thankful!

Shawn · #2 06-11-2013, 05:50 AM

Does any of that sound like love.

larrylyates · #3 06-11-2013, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawn

Does any of that sound like love.

No it does NOT! his comes from several ideas, none of which are in scripture.
my wife was actually told this by her childhood Pastor, when later in life she lost a child. He wouldn't even perform the funeral. I got a Pastor friend of mine to do it. This was 24 years ago. She lived 22 of those years believing that she'd sent her child to hell because of her then "backslidden" state.

I almost went across the desk at that Pastor.

Perhaps the best known passage actually comes from the OT and the life of King David. He was at the time, fairy "backslidden himself. Adultery. Murder. Living in sin. God told him that as a result the child would be lost to them. Most of you know the story. But watch this: David went ino fasting, prayer and mourning with sackcloth and ashes, the whole shebang. Yet AFTER the child's death what happened?

2 Samuel 12:22-24 (King James Version)
22 And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether God will be gracious to me, that the child may live?
23 But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me.
24 And David comforted Bathsheba his wife, and went in unto her, and lay with her: and she bare a son, and he called his name Solomon: and the Lord loved him.

Even after all of this David was known as a man after God's own heart. He knew instinctively that he would see this child again. A child conceived in sin to backslidden parents. Just saying!

Anyone see it differently? Can you give any scripture for it. It's a horrid idea.

Dichotomy Girl · #4 06-11-2013, 06:12 AM

I believe that they take that idea from 1 Corinthians 7:14:

14 For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her believing husband. Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy. (i.e. that at least one parent has to be "believing" or the children are unclean)

In my 10 years as an Apostolic, I only heard one lay person (and no one in the ministry) espouse this belief, so I do not think it is a common stance among Apostolics.

NewbieMisfits · #5 06-11-2013, 06:01 AM

No, it doesn't sound like love... but then Truth comes hard & sometimes Truth doesn't sound like love....

Scriptural Truth is what I am after on this. I find this so disturbing that I can only see logic in that it is a test to see if I will just go along with whatever they say, or if I will seek out my own Truth.

NewbieMisfits · #6 06-11-2013, 06:24 AM

I hate to say this, I honestly do... but then again the Truth is ugly sometimes.... This has come from a UPCI (mentor/liaison) from a Church we have come to love will all our heart. Regardless this is disturbing and doesn't separate our love for the Church, not that I believe this, but what we ask is what is the status of the heart of the two that do believe this?

bishoph · #7 06-11-2013, 07:35 AM

This teaching is a hard teaching that MAY actually have some biblical basis. IMO it is not a popular doctrine and is most likely NOT promoted often. Its basis comes from types and shadows......
Example 1.
In Genesis, God told Noah to build an ark because he was going to destroy the world. The ark was the ONLY way of escaping the judgment of God. When the flood destroyed the earth all people who were not on the ark, men, women, boys, girls, and even infants were destroyed. It could be said that had their parents gotten on the ark the children would have been saved.

If the earth was a type of the world......and
If the ark was a type of the church.....and
If the flood was a type of the judgment of God (Hell)
Then children would be lost because their parents did not get on the ark

Example 2.
Also in Genesis we find the story of Sodom & Gomorrah. The city being wicked, God told Lot and his family to leave because he was going to destroy the city. Only Lot and his two daughters escaped (his wife left but looked back) ALL others were burned in the fiery destruction including children......had their parents been willing to leave.....the children would have been spared with their parents.

If Sodom & Gomorrah is a type of the world......and
If leaving S&G is a type of leaving the world and entering the church (safety).....and
If the fire and brimstone that rained down on S&G is a type of the judgment (hell) on the wicked
Then children and infants were lost because their parents refused to leave S&G.

There are other examples that some use to back up this teaching, such as the fact that God had his people Israel kill whole nations of people including (with specific commandment to) killing all the infants and children.

While I do not endorse this teaching, I do see where it could have some merit. We live in a world where people don't want to accept responsibility for anything they do, and being given the privilege and responsibility of a child is one of the most important gifts we can be given. If people really understood that their actions DO affect others we would be more careful with the examples we set.

Also, assuming this teaching were true......this sin would be IMO no greater than any other sin that one has committed and as such would be forgiven when a person came to Christ. So just like those who deal with the guilt of an abortion, or any other sin the guilt ends with salvation.

Again, before anybody decides to hang me or shoot me.....I am just giving you the basis for why some teach this doctrine.

larrylyates · #8 06-11-2013, 07:40 AM

Ezekiel 18:20
20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

This verse indicates that the children are NOT held responsible for the sins of the parents, but rather for their own. There is also an implied support for an "age of accountability."

NewbieMisfits · #9 06-11-2013, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrylyates

Ezekiel 18:20
20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

This verse indicates that the children are NOT held responsible for the sins of the parents, but rather for their own. There is also an implied support for an "age of accountability."

Although this has been an interesting thread, I must say the above shows perfect scripture without needing to take it in any matter other than what's written.

I value all input, and am searching scriptures, from what my young-uneducated mind understands..... this would be the best fit...

Anyone disagree with this? (<scripturally<)

MarcBee · #10 06-11-2013, 11:23 PM

There is no age of accountability in the Bible. The curse of sin is inherited from Adam--sin is imputed to all humanity. Romans would have been a good place for Paul to mention the holy baby exception, if only there was one.

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned

Romans 5:18 Therefore as by the offense of one, judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

It's not what a person DOES, it's what a person IS--sinner--a legal standing. Age is irrelevant. Baby rattle snakes still have poisonous venom, even though they are born without rattle.