Destination Heaven?

[JamesGlen]

The majority of Christians, as far as I'm aware, believe that the "end destination" following death for the born again believer, is heaven.

I think that many verses that are said to be speaking of heaven, may not actually be. IE: John 14, as well as in the Revelation.

If you believe we will end up in heaven as our destination, and your hope is in that, please post your thoughts. (Hopefully along with a few passages to support your hope in such).


There are so many many songs out there with that message.


Songs like:
When we all, get to heaven, what a day of rejoicing that will be..



It has been said by some here, that "Nowhere does the Bible teach our destination is heaven"...



I'd like to read some of your posted thoughts discussed on the subject of heaven, what it is, or is not...and if it is our destination like so many songs we sing....or if it is not our destination.

[Evang.Benincasa]

There is a poster on this forum who believes that you will eat fruit and leaves in heaven. You will also constantly use the toilet because of the steady diet of roughage.

[houston]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

There is a poster on this forum who believes that you will eat fruit and leaves in heaven. You will also constantly use the toilet because of the steady diet of roughage.

There's also a big big yard where we can play football

[jediwill83]

Originally Posted by houston

There's also a big big yard where we can play football

but if Im not a fan of football wouldnt that make it hell? or we just gonna have to suck it up like,"If you dont like it loud down here you probably wont like heaven."?

[houston]

Originally Posted by jediwill83

but if Im not a fan of football wouldnt that make it hell? or we just gonna have to suck it up like,"If you dont like it loud down here you probably wont like heaven."?

We're gonna sing. We're gonna shout. We're gonna dance all about. If you don't get with the pro gram today, right now... you're not gone be with the pro gram in heaav en! I wish some of you ladies would let your hair down. Let your hair down. Your hair is not a bur den, it's a blessing. Your hair is a blessss ing!

[BrainWashed]

Originally Posted by houston

We're gonna sing. We're gonna shout. We're gonna dance all about. If you don't get with the pro gram today, right now... you're not gone be with the pro gram in heaav en! I wish some of you ladies would let your hair down. Let your hair down. Your hair is not a bur den, it's a blessing. Your hair is a blessss ing!

I thought you'd be square dancing with the "debbil."

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by houston

There's also a big big yard where we can play football

I always despised that song. Not only doctrinally in error, but just plain stupid.

[houston]

Originally Posted by Esaias

I always despised that song. Not only doctrinally in error, but just plain stupid.

I hate that song. It's a terrible terrible song. You know who else has terrible songs? North Korea. Rocket Man sings terrible terrible songs on karaoke night.

[mfblume]

I believe heaven is not meant to be our permanent home whatsoever. Temporal only. Not permanent.

Psalms 115:16 KJV The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

Mankind was created to live on the earth without death. I believe the death he took upon himself by sinning was both spiritual and physical. The Hebrew says God's warning, should he eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, was in dying thou shalt die.

Genesis 2:17 KJV But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Genesis 2:17 LITV but of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil you may not eat, for in the day that you eat of it, dying you shall die.

And the death Adam brought on mankind in Romans 5 is answered and remedied by the death Jesus died into which we must be baptized in Romans 6 so as to claim His death as fulfilling our required deaths. And since He died physically in order to remedy our deaths, that means our required deaths have to include physical death.

Romans 5:12 KJV Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Romans 6:3 KJV Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Romans 6:6-7 KJV Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. (7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.

So sin is clearly remedied by physical death, because Christ took the penalty we were meant to take, thus removing it from us.

And here we read the death we were meant to suffer was the reason Jesus died, to take it as us, so as to leave us as those who paid the debt through Him, not requiring us to pay it again.

Hebrews 9:27-28 KJV And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: (28) So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

That being said, man was meant to live forever on earth before he sinned. And when he sinned, God set out to save us and restore us. Salvation is restoration to get us back on the original track and purpose. We are not given a PLAN B that is totally different from the original plan for Adam before his sin. Adam was not meant to die and go to heaven. So, salvation restores us to Adam's purpose of ruling on this earth forever.

And this is where the original passages I quoted comes into play.

Psalms 115:16 KJV The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

Even after man sinned, and people die and go to heaven, heaven is still NOT OURS. It is God's. The EARTH is ours. We're meant to be here.

So, when we die we temporarily go to Heaven until we get the resurrection bodies that are actually a restored version of what Adam had before sin. And bodies are not made for heaven, because we don't need them to go to heaven when we die today. They are EARTH SUITS. Physical-realm suits. God meant for us to forever be the material version of what He is in heaven. King and ruler. And God created the physical universe while He, Himself, is not physical whatsoever.

Jesus as Son of God only existed as SON because sin entered the equation and had to be remedied as well as our need to have a SECOND ADAM. Otherwise God would never have manifested in flesh as Christ. But rather than have Adam as head now, Christ Himself is become our "ADAM." God in flesh is a better "Adam," anyway!

And so after the resurrection, when we have our immortal bodies and death does not exist IN ANY FORM ANY MORE, we will be back on the earth forever and ruling it as Adam was meant to. And God will fill us as He would have filled Adam had he eaten of the fruit of Life, so God would manifest through us and co-rule the world with us.

God made man to be both spiritual and natural because God, Who is a Spirit, wants to indwell man in the natural realm and manifest through us to affect the natural realm as though he, Himself, were naturally made. But the added benefit is that He has US WITH HIM now, whom He loves! He was all alone before that.

[n david]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I believe heaven is not meant to be our permanent home whatsoever. Temporal only. Not permanent.

Psalms 115:16 KJV The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

Mankind was created to live on the earth without death. I believe the death he took upon himself by sinning was both spiritual and physical. The Hebrew says God's warning, should he eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, was in dying thou shalt die.

Genesis 2:17 KJV But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Genesis 2:17 LITV but of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil you may not eat, for in the day that you eat of it, dying you shall die.

And the death Adam brought on mankind in Romans 5 is answered and remedied by the death Jesus died into which we must be baptized in Romans 6 so as to claim His death as fulfilling our required deaths. And since He died physically in order to remedy our deaths, that means our required deaths have to include physical death.

Romans 5:12 KJV Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Romans 6:3 KJV Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Romans 6:6-7 KJV Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. (7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.

So sin is clearly remedied by physical death, because Christ took the penalty we were meant to take, thus removing it from us.

And here we read the death we were meant to suffer was the reason Jesus died, to take it as us, so as to leave us as those who paid the debt through Him, not requiring us to pay it again.

Hebrews 9:27-28 KJV And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: (28) So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

That being said, man was meant to live forever on earth before he sinned. And when he sinned, God set out to save us and restore us. Salvation is restoration to get us back on the original track and purpose. We are not given a PLAN B that is totally different from the original plan for Adam before his sin. Adam was not meant to die and go to heaven. So, salvation restores us to Adam's purpose of ruling on this earth forever.

And this is where the original passages I quoted comes into play.

Psalms 115:16 KJV The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

Even after man sinned, and people die and go to heaven, heaven is still NOT OURS. It is God's. The EARTH is ours. We're meant to be here.

So, when we die we temporarily go to Heaven until we get the resurrection bodies that are actually a restored version of what Adam had before sin. And bodies are not made for heaven, because we don't need them to go to heaven when we die today. They are EARTH SUITS. Physical-realm suits. God meant for us to forever be the material version of what He is in heaven. King and ruler. And God created the physical universe while He, Himself, is not physical whatsoever.

Jesus as Son of God only existed as SON because sin entered the equation and had to be remedied as well as our need to have a SECOND ADAM. Otherwise God would never have manifested in flesh as Christ. But rather than have Adam as head now, Christ Himself is become our "ADAM." God in flesh is a better "Adam," anyway!

And so after the resurrection, when we have our immortal bodies and death does not exist IN ANY FORM ANY MORE, we will be back on the earth forever and ruling it as Adam was meant to. And God will fill us as He would have filled Adam had he eaten of the fruit of Life, so God would manifest through us and co-rule the world with us.

God made man to be both spiritual and natural because God, Who is a Spirit, wants to indwell man in the natural realm and manifest through us to affect the natural realm as though he, Himself, were naturally made. But the added benefit is that He has US WITH HIM now, whom He loves! He was all alone before that.

A few questions:
You don't believe we'll live in heaven, that we'll be there only temporarily. You said the earth is man's. And you stated that we'll have physical bodies like Adam had in the beginning.

1) Is the earth you believe we'll inhabit the current earth? If so, how do you reconcile that to 2 Peter 3:10 and other scriptures which point to an end of earth. Also, why would Jesus speak of His Father's house and mansions if we're only to live on this earth?

2) Adam was flesh and blood as we are, yet the Bible says we will be changed and transformed when we are caught away. Do you believe we will be flesh and blood?

3) Who will we rule over? Who rules over whom?

I was taught, and believed that the earth will be destroyed. It won't be around anymore at all. There will be a new heaven and a new earth. We will live with Him forever. We will not be flesh and blood, but will be eternal, spiritual beings. And I've heard a couple different viewpoints on ruling, but haven't thought about it much to form my own belief. The first is that there is some type of hierarchy of rulers, saints who will rule over other saints. The second is that the faithful saints will preside in the judgment.