Westboro Funeral Pickets Are Protected Speech

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

But any private business should be able to hire or fire who they want to. (Of course we know that this is not the case in today's court system)

With and without provocation or justification?

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by CC1

I would like to tell you that I am so spirutual I only have love for the Westboro Baptist church folks. However what I have is probably a little of both rightous and unrightous indignation.

Those folks have done more harm to true Christians than just about anything the devil directly does. I say directly because I have not doubt Satan is using this group for his purposes.

There are only a few groups of people that I would not feel badly if some horrific accident happened to them that wiped them off the face of the earth. This is one of those groups. Certainly my first wish is that they repent and become true Christians. In lieu of that I would be just fine if their van ran off a 1,000 foot cliff and they could see the Jesus they profess to serve as quickly as possible and learn the error of their ways. These people are evil incarnate.

Galatians 5:19 KJV - Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Galatians 5:20 KJV - Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Galatians 5:21 KJV - Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told Unregistered in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Galatians 5:22 KJV - But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Galatians 5:23 KJV - Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Galatians 5:24 KJV - And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Galatians 5:25 KJV - If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Galatians 5:26 KJV - Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

I think they fall into the works of the flesh column much easier than the fruit of the spirit column.

They which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

[Digging4Truth]

First let me include a part of the quote you left out...

I stand offering correction if I am wrong on this...

But any private business should be able to hire or fire who they want to. (Of course we know that this is not the case in today's court system)

That was poorly worded now that I look at it but I hope the intent still shines through.

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

With and without provocation or justification?

Now... having cleared that up. What do you mean by "with and without provocation or justification?"

While awaiting your reply I will say this. It seems to me that a man who owns his own business should feel free to fire someone if he finds their behavior distasteful or that it shines a bad light on his business.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

The comments in this thread are encouraging. We are all disgusted by their actions but to see so many with such a good understanding of free speech is, indeed, refreshing.

I think the Court had to uphold their right to free speech.
Free speech is not just speech that certain people agree with.

Now, if we could jest get rid of some of this PC (Politically Correct) junk that we all have to tip toe around.

[sandie]

Don't most employers have an "at will" clause in their employment records?

I've never worked for anyone that didn't have the "at will" clause.

From Wikipedia,
At-will employment is a doctrine of American law that defines an employment relationship in which either party can break the relationship with no liability, provided there was no express contract for a definite term governing the employment relationship and that the employer does not belong to a collective bargaining group (i.e., has not recognized a union). Under this legal doctrine:

“ any hiring is presumed to be "at will"; that is, the employer is free to discharge individuals "for good cause, or bad cause, or no cause at all," and the employee is equally free to quit, strike, or otherwise cease work.[1] ”

Several exceptions to the doctrine exist, especially if unlawful discrimination is involved regarding the termination of an employee. "At-will employment" also does not by itself make terminated employees ineligible for unemployment claims and compensation if they are terminated without cause.

As a means of downsizing, such as closing an unprofitable factory, a company may terminate employees en masse. However, there are legal limitations upon the employer's ability to terminate without reason.

[missourimary]

Originally Posted by Ferd

thinking out loud here... dont even know if this is legal...dont worry I am not advocating any harm to anyone/thing...


but, is it leagal for those in that community to simply step away from the WBC people?

refuse to do any business with them? if they have jobs in the community to fire them for their inflamitory comments?

I know if I were to say some of the things they have said, I would be fired here at my job... and rightfully so.

The government has not role to play here but there is pressure that ought to be brought to bare.

My understanding is that one of the local colleges refused to admit one (two?) of them to law school. The church sued and won. http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2011/fe...gainst-washbu/

Individually, from what I've read, most of them don't act out on their jobs the way they do when they picket. And since many work for the same law firm, owned by daddy, there isn't much for them to get fired from.

They pull away into their own community as it is. And see any negative input from outside (or in) as persecution.

And maybe things are different in other states, but it seems like Kansans have a huge propensity to sue if they are fired for anything, no matter what it is, especially if several people in their family or group have all been fired from the same or similar companies.

[CC1]

What is really wild about Westboro is that the pastor is a very educated man. He is a lawyer who was pretty famous advocating for civil rights decades ago. People who worked with him then are shocked at what he is doing now.

While much of the"church" is members of his own family he also has had close family members denounce him. If I remember correctly I believe at least one grown daughter or son.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

First let me include a part of the quote you left out...



That was poorly worded now that I look at it but I hope the intent still shines through.



Now... having cleared that up. What do you mean by "with and without provocation or justification?"

While awaiting your reply I will say this. It seems to me that a man who owns his own business should feel free to fire someone if he finds their behavior distasteful or that it shines a bad light on his business.

In your opinion (and anyone else who wants to comment), should private business owners or government agencies be able to fire anyone for any reason or no reason at all?

[aegsm76]

Private business - yes
In reality, though you cannot do this.
Most states are at-will states, but you cannot fire someone on the basis of race, sex, age, religion, or other protected classes.
Now you can fire them, but then you must prove that it was not due to any protected class/reason.
Otherwise, get ready for an EEOC charge and a lawsuit.

Public sector - we have moved beyond the "spoils" system, so this needs handled differently than the private sector.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

In your opinion (and anyone else who wants to comment), should private business owners or government agencies be able to fire anyone for any reason or no reason at all?

I don't know about government agencies.

But a person who owns a private business of their own should have the right to fire anyone they choose to fire in my opinion.