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Old 05-02-2011, 01:11 PM
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ForeverBlessed ForeverBlessed is offline
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John 20:22

I've been leading a bible study recently where two of the members have already received the Spirit baptism.

I was asked recently about this scripture in John 20. Why is the Holy Ghost they received here any different than what they received in Acts chapter 2.

I have my thoughts, and have shared them, but can't honestly say that I am perfectly clear myself. I do not like teaching something that I have questions about.

I am teaching a group of Nazarene's that have been taught all their lives that tongues are not for us today and ceased with the book of Acts.

If I could get some to share what they feel happened in John chapter 20, I would like to study some more and will be appreciative of all input.

thanks
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:15 PM
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Sam Sam is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Jesus “breathed upon them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost” KJV
In the Amplified Bible it says “Receive (admit) the Holy Spirit.”
Ken Wuest translates this in the Expanded NT as “Receive at once the Holy Spirit.”
Malcolm Smith translates/paraphrases it as “Receive here and now the Holy Spirit.”

There are differences of opinion on what actually happened here that night as they saw and believed in the resurrected Christ and acknowledged Him as Lord.

Some believe this was a symbolic gesture, a preview of when the Holy Spirit would come 50 days later on the Day of Pentecost. John Mac Arthur has a note in his Study Bible which says, “Since the disciples did not actually receive the Holy Spirit until the day of Pentecost, some 40 days in the future (Acts 1:8;2:1-3),this statement must be understood as a pledge on Christ’s part that the Holy Spirit would be coming.” Those who hold to this view believe that the disciples were not born again or did not have New Testament salvation at this time but that they would be saved/born again on the Day of Pentecost.

Others believe that this was the beginning of the New Testament dispensation. The disciples had been saved/born again by faith and this was the actual impartation of the Holy Spirit coming to dwell within them. He had been with them but now He was within them. Later, on the Day of Pentecost, the disciples were baptized in and empowered by the Holy Spirit. David J. DuPlessis said, “The upper room on the resurrection day was a maternity ward. Pentecost was a baptismal service,” Those who hold this view believe that a person is born of the Spirit by faith in Jesus and then as a child of God has a promise of a baptism in the Holy Spirit which is called ”the promise of the Father” as an experience subsequent to salvation/regeneration.

Here is a note from The Spirit Filled Life Bible
“The allusion to Gen 2:7 is unmistakable. Now, Jesus breathed life into His own. Some interpret this statement, ‘receive the Holy Ghost’ as symbolic and as anticipating Pentecost. Others understand the Greek to denote immediacy, in the sense of ‘receive right now’ and view the day of the Lord’s resurrection as marking the transition from the terms of the old covenant to those of the new covenant. The old creation began with the breath of God; now the new creation begins with the breath of God the Son.” page 1613

Here is a quote from Derek Prince’s Foundation Series, Vol 2 page 60
“...the tense of the imperative form ‘receive’ indicated that the receiving was a single, complete experience which took place as Jesus uttered the word. It is therefore an incontestable, scriptural fact that at that moment the apostles did actually receive the Spirit.
In this first encounter with the resurrected Christ, the apostles passed from ‘Old Testament salvation’ to ‘New Testament salvation.’ Up to that time the believers of the OT had looked forward by faith, through prophecies and types and shadows, to a redemptive act which had not yet taken place. Those who enter into ‘NT salvation,’ on the other hand look back with clear vision to a single historical event: the death and resurrection of Christ. Their salvation is complete.”

A Jay Snell Evangelistic Assoc. Publication dated June/July 1998 says:
“He meant for them to ‘receive’ the Holy Ghost then and there. How do we know this? We know it because ‘receive’ is in the imperative mood in the Greek text. The imperative mood in the Greek had no future. It was the mood a Greek would use to tell someone very strongly that he/she wanted them to do something now. In other words, Jesus meant for them to ‘receive’ the Holy Ghost then and there. He issued the directive of a command to be obeyed at once. There never was a future concerning the Greek imperative. It always meant ‘do it now.’”
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  #3  
Old 05-02-2011, 05:45 PM
staysharp staysharp is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverBlessed View Post
I've been leading a bible study recently where two of the members have already received the Spirit baptism.

I was asked recently about this scripture in John 20. Why is the Holy Ghost they received here any different than what they received in Acts chapter 2.

I have my thoughts, and have shared them, but can't honestly say that I am perfectly clear myself. I do not like teaching something that I have questions about.

I am teaching a group of Nazarene's that have been taught all their lives that tongues are not for us today and ceased with the book of Acts.

If I could get some to share what they feel happened in John chapter 20, I would like to study some more and will be appreciative of all input.

thanks
IMO the gift of tongues is not the evidence of the Holy Spirit. Paul clearly teaches tongues as a sign the Holy Spirit is at work. A sign leads to a greater reality. The sign says "rocks ahead", the rock falling would be the reality of the sign.

Herein lies the problem with telling someone that receiving the Holy Spirit is the same as receiving the gift of tongues. There is clear biblical evidence of the Holy Spirit; ie the fruit it brings. Tongues can be replicated, but love cannot.

Jesus promised his followers the Holy Spirit as a helper, a comforter, a testifier of Christ in this present world, he never said anything about a tongue talker...
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:46 PM
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Apprehended Apprehended is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Like many other commandments of Jesus that must be followed through after his crucifixion and glorification (since the Holy Ghost was not yet given) he commanded them to receive the Holy Ghost which they gladly received fifty days after the cross. Connected with that same verse is the 23 verse which commands the disciples to remit sins.
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Old 05-02-2011, 06:00 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Quote:
Some believe this was a symbolic gesture, a preview of when the Holy Spirit would come 50 days later on the Day of Pentecost. John Mac Arthur has a note in his Study Bible which says, “Since the disciples did not actually receive the Holy Spirit until the day of Pentecost, some 40 days in the future (Acts 1:8;2:1-3),this statement must be understood as a pledge on Christ’s part that the Holy Spirit would be coming.” Those who hold to this view believe that the disciples were not born again or did not have New Testament salvation at this time but that they would be saved/born again on the Day of Pentecost.
I never thought I would agree with John Macarthur on anything. But hats off to John as he has this exactly right. They did not receive the Holy Spirit until Pentecost.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:40 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: John 20:22

This was a commission not an impartation. They were commanded to receive the Spirit
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Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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  #7  
Old 05-03-2011, 11:22 AM
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ForeverBlessed ForeverBlessed is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Thanks to all who responded, I am at work... have read and thinking on this today. I will continue to study. I really appreciate those who took the time to post.

I try not to waste time on internet at work anymore, but will respond later this evening.
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  #8  
Old 05-03-2011, 11:26 AM
sandie sandie is offline
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Re: John 20:22

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apprehended View Post
Like many other commandments of Jesus that must be followed through after his crucifixion and glorification (since the Holy Ghost was not yet given) he commanded them to receive the Holy Ghost which they gladly received fifty days after the cross. Connected with that same verse is the 23 verse which commands the disciples to remit sins.
So, He wasn't imparting to them the HG, He was telling them when the time came to "recieve" the HG.
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Old 05-03-2011, 05:53 PM
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Re: John 20:22

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Originally Posted by sandie View Post
So, He wasn't imparting to them the HG, He was telling them when the time came to "recieve" the HG.
Amen.

The bible says that the Holy Ghost was not yet given.

Thus he breathed on them, signifying that the Holy Ghost is the breath of God that will come as a wind. Thus, it came as a mighty rushing wind on the day of Pentecost. His commandment to them was to receive it.

As I understand it...
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:20 PM
kclee4jc kclee4jc is offline
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Re: John 20:22

I agree that this was a command and not an impartation. A pointing forward to the day of Pentecost.

Now...i have to share a funny story. I was once visiting a revival in a small church and for some reason or other the evangelist didnt show up. So one of the men who attended the church decided he would preach. He got up and started preaching and was pretty fired up...not much anointing that i could feel. At the end of his message he called me forward and wanted to "pray" for me. He then proceeded to tell me that he was about to blow on me and give me an impartation (as he asked someone to stand behind me and catch me when i fell). I was a bit dismayed at this but didnt say much. So then he started to speak in tongues and said "alright! get ready! here it comes!" and blew in my face! Nothing happened... So some more tongues then more blowing. This continued in the same vein at least 3 or 4 times and much to his dissappointment i never did fall. Much more to his dissappointment i stated to snicker a little toward the end. :-/ Not trying to hijack...just thought i would share a humorous story... :-)

Last edited by kclee4jc; 05-03-2011 at 08:22 PM.
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