Denying the Lord and still Saved? - Page 3

RandyWayne · #21 02-09-2012, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

These images of being delivered up for torture to make a stand for Christ, and avoiding coercion to speak something that your heart would not agree with is the imagining of a child. It has no basis in reality. Our common image of being brought into some chamber to testify in front of satan and allowing the Holy Spirit to speak through us, "then," is equally naive. It is called The RevelatioN, and we must understand I AM before we can really even begin to have any relevant doctrinal discussions.

This future scenario casting is a device designed to displace your center in time, and it works great.

Well, my response to THAT is....

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together. See how they run like pigs from a gun, see how they fly. I'm crying. Sitting in an English garden waiting for the sun. If the sun don't come, you get a tan. From standing in the English rain. I am the eggman, they are the eggmen.

bbyrd009 · #22 02-09-2012, 11:55 AM

Ha, more eggs. Understand why "here a little there a little," then if you would, completely ignoring my last post. Consider why God's nonsense is better than man's sense in this light, nevermind my post. The point being that any Word that gets through to us has to overcome an obstacle. Also, that may have been for someone else. Obviously so, if you entertain no delusions of the sort referenced.
Ps have you seen the lyrics to that "translated?" pretty cool

Jay · #23 02-09-2012, 02:04 PM

I do not believe that a person who denies Christ will not be saved if they do not repent before death. I do believe that a person can repent, but I do believe that they must have time to repent. There are too many examples of people who held out until the end.

When Jesus said that if we loved life more than Him, He did not exclude us from deaths that would include great suffering. This is why He said that His people should have a greater love for Him rather than for our own families. We are to count all as lost for Him and His service. No matter the pain, suffering, sacrifice, or death.

The Matt · #24 02-09-2012, 03:07 PM

I sure don't want the last words out of my mouth to be "I deny ____"

Adam · #25 02-09-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Huh?

You really really need to start taking something.

An English class, perhaps?

bbyrd009 · #26 02-09-2012, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam

An English class, perhaps?

Ya, that might help. My English is surely deficient, allow me to apologize.
And, from now on, I'll do my best to only say things you agree with or can easily understand and agree with, too.

bbyrd009 · #27 02-09-2012, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay

I do not believe that a person who denies Christ will not be saved if they do not repent before death. I do believe that a person can repent, but I do believe that they must have time to repent. There are too many examples of people who held out until the end.

When Jesus said that if we loved life more than Him, He did not exclude us from deaths that would include great suffering. This is why He said that His people should have a greater love for Him rather than for our own families. We are to count all as lost for Him and His service. No matter the pain, suffering, sacrifice, or death.

Hey, Jay, could you rephrase the first line? Ty, and is this the reply to the "all people in spiritual bodies after the millenium when satan is released for a short period" answer, or is that another thread? ty. No way to get notifications when one is quoted here, correct?

Jay · #28 02-09-2012, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Matt

I sure don't want the last words out of my mouth to be "I deny ____"

I will agree with that. I am reminded of report that I heard from the period of the Inquisition. A young man had been put in a vice that squeezed around his torso, after a time he yielded and denied Christ. They took him out, but it was too late to save his life. A young lady who was not known to be Protestant cried out, "You fool, you fool, just a few more minutes and Heaven would have been yours." At this she was seized and commanded to recant. Upon her refusal, they placed her in that vice, and followed the same procedure. However, she went to her death praising and worshiping.

Jay · #29 02-09-2012, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay

I do not believe that a person who denies Christ will not be saved if they do not repent before death. I do believe that a person can repent, but I do believe that they must have time to repent. There are too many examples of people who held out until the end.

When Jesus said that if we loved life more than Him, He did not exclude us from deaths that would include great suffering. This is why He said that His people should have a greater love for Him rather than for our own families. We are to count all as lost for Him and His service. No matter the pain, suffering, sacrifice, or death.

My first statement should have read thus: Unless he repents, a man who denies Christ will not be saved.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Hey, Jay, could you rephrase the first line? Ty, and is this the reply to the "all people in spiritual bodies after the millenium when satan is released for a short period" answer, or is that another thread? ty. No way to get notifications when one is quoted here, correct?

Bbyrd, I hope that this clarifies that statement. Sadly, I was unable to edit it, although I would if I could.

trialedbyfire · #30 02-09-2012, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay

I do not believe that a person who denies Christ will not be saved if they do not repent before death. I do believe that a person can repent, but I do believe that they must have time to repent. There are too many examples of people who held out until the end.

When Jesus said that if we loved life more than Him, He did not exclude us from deaths that would include great suffering. This is why He said that His people should have a greater love for Him rather than for our own families. We are to count all as lost for Him and His service. No matter the pain, suffering, sacrifice, or death.

That's why if we're going to endure until the end we need to be prayed up NOW and strong in our faith NOW before it gets "really" bad.

Our suffering will be rewarded. It is temporary.

"For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us." Romans 8:18

Remember, this was written to a church in a time of great persecution. If you can't fathom being tortured or killed for your faith, you need to spend more time in prayer and fasting, because we never know when the gun will be pointed to our heads.

Remember Columbine?

We need to be prepared, all baiting aside to suffer for Christ's name sake. When Christ said take up your cross, he very well could have meant that literally in some cases. Peter, WAS crucified. Do I want to be tortured for my faith and killed? No. Do I know how it feels? No. Do I absolutely know that in the face of torture I wouldn't deny Christ? No. But I pray to God everyday for the strength to endure. I believe he will perserve those who want to be perserved so the whole "what happens if..." line of questioning is a moot point. God gives to those who ask. Grace is not an excuse for sin. Grace gives us a God-given ability to overcome it.

"There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it." 1 Corinthians 10:13

This verse sums it up in it's entirety. God will not ask of us more then we can handle. If he commands us to be true to him in the midst of persecution, that we must, and HE will provide the grace, he will provide the means. My flesh of course fears the idea of ruthless torture, but my spirit knows that my God is faithful, and if he is faithful he'll remain true to his word.

My heart is determined to be saved. My salvation is based on my faith and confession in Christ and my obedience to him and his word. I am therefore to keep my confession by faith and be obedience to him. God will give me grace to do so, I believe it. I don't know how. I lay on my face and cry every night asking God to strengthen this generation, because we are so weak and comfortable and don't even see the battlelines being drawn. We MUST seek Gods will on this. He's given us HIS spirit. Do you not know what the SPIRIT OF CHRIST allowed Christ to endure? Do you not know what type of spirit is in you?

People have the HOLY GHOST deep down in their souls and say they can't stop drinking, smoking, cussing, and watching pornography. Do you know who God is?

No excuses saints. This is the time when our tests will be proven. The Originial Poster of this thread believes that we are crazy, but it will be our generation that will once again PROVE GOD'S WORD TO BE TRUE.

If you, those who have the Holy Ghost say that you can't handle the torture your making God out to be a liar, because HIS WORD said you CAN...

...but your faith is required. I'll withstand with the help, grace, and mercy of MY GOD and it will be a testimony to the sinner man I pray, that God must be who he says he is, if a man would lay down everything for him. God help this generation.