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  #61  
Old 02-18-2012, 03:43 PM
Titus2woman Titus2woman is offline


 
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
Glanced over article posted, didn't see where addressed women bishops.
Again. What. Is. A. Bishop?
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  #62  
Old 02-18-2012, 03:47 PM
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Titus2woman View Post
Again. What. Is. A. Bishop?
Overseer/elder ove the church.
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Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
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  #63  
Old 02-18-2012, 04:00 PM
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Michael Phelps Michael Phelps is offline
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by seekerman View Post
I've posted the passage over and over....here it is again....

1Ti 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

A bishop *MUST BE*....the HUSBAND of one WIFE.
Literal translation? Must have only one wife, not multiple ones. Not to be used to prove that a Bishop can only be a man.

If your argument is to hold water, then you would have to assume that based on this scripture in Timothy "I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting." must mean that only men can pray, and not women.
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Last edited by Michael Phelps; 02-18-2012 at 04:51 PM.
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  #64  
Old 02-18-2012, 04:02 PM
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Michael Phelps Michael Phelps is offline
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Re: Women Bishop

This reminds me of the story about the bumblebee. Based on weight ratios to wing power and wind resistance, the bumblebee should be incapable of flight, yet, the theory says, the bumblebee doesn’t know that, so it flies anyway.

Based on man's interpretation of scripture, women can be preachers.....of course, the women don't know that, so they preach anyway. And people get healed. And saved. And lives are changed.

So, women - just keep doing what you're doing.
__________________
"Many people view their relationship with God like a "color by number" picture. It's easier to let someone else define the boundaries, tell them which blanks to fill in, and what color to use than it is for them to take a blank canvas and seek inspiration from the Source in order to paint their own masterpiece"
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  #65  
Old 02-18-2012, 04:05 PM
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Titus2woman View Post
Continued....

So, women could lead a prayer, reveal words from God, and teach. Not only this, but the ability to prophesy was one of the spiritual favors (gifts) of the Spirit. These women who were speaking about spiritual matter before Christians (see 1 Corinthians 14:4), not only had God’s passive acceptance, but His active appointment. Just think about that — God actively appointed women to receive spiritual gifts, in order for these women to do miraculous works, and it wasn’t just the quiet gifts, like healing, but even the important, miraculous speaking gifts (1 Corinthians 14:5), like prophesying (i.e., revealing words from God)!

Before we leave chapter eleven, let’s look at two other items. First, take note of 1 Corinthians 11:3 in the Bible, where the term “head of” is used. The Companion Reference Guide to the Christian Bible says this under the word “head”: “when something is symbolically the ‘head of’ something else, it means either the ‘source of life for’ or the ‘top of’; but it never meant ‘authority over.’ ” The head provides air, food, and water for the body. In like manner a husband is the source of life for his wife, as he works to provide for her and the children that she bears. But this verse absolutely does not say that men have authority over women!

Secondly, notice verse eleven: “However, in their union with the Master, woman isn’t distinct from man, or man distinct from woman.” – 1 Cor. 11:11 (CB). As it says in the footnote to this verse in the Christian Bible: “Women aren’t distinct (or inferior) to men as taught in Pharisaism (Pharisee-ism) and other male-superiority beliefs; nor are men distinct (or inferior) to women as taught in Pagan Gnosticism and other female-superiority beliefs.”

Now, let’s go over and look at the fourteenth chapter of 1 Corinthians in the Bible, but first I want to emphasize that it is still Paul who is dictating the writing, and he has already said in chapter eleven that women can pray, teach, and speak before Christians. Also note, that to start at 1 Corinthians 14:34 is to take things out of context, since this whole topic began back at the beginning of chapter twelve.

Instead of talking about these two applicable verses in chapter fourteen, I am going to just quote them from the Christian Bible, the most literal translation of the Bible we have today. The words in brackets are the Christian Bible translator’s explanations that occur wherever there is something that was obvious to “First Century” Christians reading the Bible in the original Greek, which might not be obvious to you, as you read an English translation of the Bible.

“Your women must be silent in the groups of Called Ones, for no permission is being given to them to speak [only people with spiritual favors of the speaking-types were to be speaking]! Rather, they must be subservient [to those who were authorized to speak, and not be interrupting them or challenging them with questions], just as the Law also says [Num. 12:1-15]! Now if they want to learn about something, they must be asking their own husbands [or fathers] at home; for it is shameful for a woman to be continually speaking in a group of Called Ones [if they don’t have one of the speaking-types of spiritual favors].” – 1 Cor. 14:34-35 (CB).

Doesn’t it seem to you, that we have some disruptive women here who are interrupting and challenging the speakers with endless questions? Only people who had a speaking gift were to be speaking; and some of those people were women, whom the Spirit had given a gift of being able to prophesy or say appropriate prayers.

Paul also said in chapter thirteen that these miraculous gifts from the Spirit would disappear when maturity came. That maturity came 1900 some years ago; now none of us have these speaking gifts. Male Christians are no more talented or able, than female Christians, to proclaim the “Good Message,” to teach, to pray, to read, or to sing. Who is there who will forbid a sister from informing us of her insight?

I want you to also know that it is a well-known fact among Koine Greek scholars, that it is proper Greek to use masculine nouns for a nonspecific person (who may be a female) or for a nonspecific group (which may include females)! So, when God’s Word and other Koine Greek literature use Greek words that mean things like man, men, fathers, patriarch, brother, or brethren; and the context shows that the meaning is nonspecific, the words literally mean person, people, parents, ancestor, sibling (brother or sister), and brothers and sisters.

However, don’t expect the KJV Bible and the other “Church Bibles” to properly translate nonspecific masculine nouns. Either out of ignorance or design they do not literally translate these words; and thereby make God’s Word look male chauvinistic.

Do deacon, minister, and servant all mean the same thing to you? No? Well, they don’t mean the same thing to our dictionaries or in churches, either! But all three of these words are used by the KJV Bible to translate the Greek noun DIAKONOS which literally means a servant or a dispenser of something. However, the KJV Bible uses the word servant when it is talking about a woman (Phoebe) in Romans 16:1. But for a man (Tychicus) in Ephesians 6:21, it instead uses the word minister. Plus, then for some other men in 1 Timothy 3:12, it uses the title deacon. My brothers and sisters, you’ve been lied to, cheated, and robbed of the whole Truth!

In the Bible's sixteenth chapter of Romans, Paul singled out 29 of his co-workers in the spreading of the Good Message, to whom he specifically sent his greetings, and 10 of these co-workers were women. Are we not in danger of being found to be fighters against God, if we don’t acknowledge the equality of our sisters?
Oh come on, don't confuse us with the facts!!!!!!!!
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"Many people view their relationship with God like a "color by number" picture. It's easier to let someone else define the boundaries, tell them which blanks to fill in, and what color to use than it is for them to take a blank canvas and seek inspiration from the Source in order to paint their own masterpiece"
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  #66  
Old 02-18-2012, 04:18 PM
Titus2woman Titus2woman is offline


 
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Michael Phelps View Post
This reminds me of the story about the bumblebee. Based on weight ratios to wing power and wind resistance, the bumblebee should be incapable of flight, yet, the theory says, the bumblebee doesn’t know that, so it flies anyway.

Based on man's interpretation of scripture, women can be preachers.....of course, the women don't know that, so they preach anyway. And people get healed. And saved. And lives are changed.

So, women - just keep doing what you're doing.
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  #67  
Old 02-18-2012, 04:59 PM
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Truthseeker Truthseeker is offline
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Michael Phelps View Post
Literal translation? Must have only one wife, not multiple ones. Not to be used to prove that a Bishop can only be a man.

If your argument is to hold water, then you would have to assume that based on this scripture in Timothy "I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting." must mean that only men can pray, and not women.
Poor comparison. Actually mentions husband of one wife.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
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  #68  
Old 02-18-2012, 06:11 PM
Titus2woman Titus2woman is offline


 
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
Poor comparison. Actually mentions husband of one wife.
Changes nothing
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  #69  
Old 02-18-2012, 06:13 PM
seekerman seekerman is offline
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Re: Women Bishop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Phelps View Post
"A bishop *MUST BE*....the HUSBAND of one WIFE."

Literal translation? Must have only one wife, not multiple ones. Not to be used to prove that a Bishop can only be a man.

If your argument is to hold water, then you would have to assume that based on this scripture in Timothy "I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting." must mean that only men can pray, and not women.
In the NAJ (New Adjusted Translation", "must be" should be eliminated, "husband" taken out, "wife" taken out so that the passage reads...

"a bishop should be breathing."
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  #70  
Old 02-18-2012, 07:27 PM
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Michael Phelps Michael Phelps is offline
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Re: Women Bishop

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
Poor comparison. Actually mentions husband of one wife.
I thought it was a pretty good comparison. Nomenclature in King James' era used the masculine quite often to refer to all "mankind". Which includes women by the way, even though the term is "man"kind.

But, that logic may be too much for your limited viewpoint.
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