Angels: Ministering Spirits

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

If I felt I was completely off, it would trouble me. The emotion and message behind the utterance just wouldn't match in my mind with the interpretation I gave.

Does this not seem too subjective to you? I mean, judging inspired utterances, interpretations specifically, based entirely on what the interpreter 'feels'? I understand what you are saying, but I also know that we can deceive ourselves. Sometimes something feels 'so right' when it simply isn't. Knowhuttamean?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Esaias,

So, I hope the "divine energies" example helped you to see how one can Scripturally draw an "implication" from Scripture without having exact text on it. While you don't have to agree... Can you see where one might walk away believing that there is a divine power, energy, virtue, or whatever one might call it, that can flow out from a person filled with God... into a physical object?

I'm curious. Because if so, I'm going to take it to another level.

The words coming to my mind are 'amulet' and 'talisman'. When I was 'serving the darkside' (lol) a common technique was to imbue an object with 'energy', directed by intention. The object would retain the energy which was 'shaped' by the intention, thereby making a talisman or amulet (actually, the technical term was 'weapon').

I know there were 'special miracles' in Acts, such as 'handkerchiefs' taken from the apostles' bodies and placed upon the sick and lame who were then healed. Also, an angel 'troubled the waters' at a pool and the first one in got healed. Also, the woman touched 'the hem of His garment'.

But I would be very cautious about intentionally seeking to recreate those or similar things...

Have you read Nee's 'The Spiritual Man'? I think I asked you once before but don't recall if you said you had or not.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Does this not seem too subjective to you? I mean, judging inspired utterances, interpretations specifically, based entirely on what the interpreter 'feels'? I understand what you are saying, but I also know that we can deceive ourselves. Sometimes something feels 'so right' when it simply isn't. Knowhuttamean?

Yes, and I agree. That's why it takes being truly led of the Spirit, even in the effort to interpret tongues. God will often confirm the interpretation through another interpreter... or through circumstances that arise in the lives of those to whom it is directed after the interpretation.

But if we think about it... it's all very subjective... even preaching. Preachers often preach different messages, angles, and interpretations of Scripture too. Yet God confirms it through those who are knowledgeable regarding the various ways the text can be handled and through confirmation of the message in the lives of those two whom the preached Word is directed. Again, being led of the Spirit in preaching is also a key factor.

This is where head knowledge becomes of little value. One must... walk in the Spirit.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The words coming to my mind are 'amulet' and 'talisman'. When I was 'serving the darkside' (lol) a common technique was to imbue an object with 'energy', directed by intention. The object would retain the energy which was 'shaped' by the intention, thereby making a talisman or amulet (actually, the technical term was 'weapon').

I know there were 'special miracles' in Acts, such as 'handkerchiefs' taken from the apostles' bodies and placed upon the sick and lame who were then healed. Also, an angel 'troubled the waters' at a pool and the first one in got healed. Also, the woman touched 'the hem of His garment'.

But I would be very cautious about intentionally seeking to recreate those or similar things...

Have you read Nee's 'The Spiritual Man'? I think I asked you once before but don't recall if you said you had or not.

I did read it a long time ago. It was a good read.

I must ask... Why should one be cautious about intentionally seeking to recreate those similar things? Is it out of "fear" of something? Fear isn't faith. And God hasn't given us a spirit of fear. The church can't move forward and do the "greater works" as promised if we fear stepping out and just doing them and letting the chips fall where they may.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The words coming to my mind are 'amulet' and 'talisman'. When I was 'serving the darkside' (lol) a common technique was to imbue an object with 'energy', directed by intention. The object would retain the energy which was 'shaped' by the intention, thereby making a talisman or amulet (actually, the technical term was 'weapon').

I know there were 'special miracles' in Acts, such as 'handkerchiefs' taken from the apostles' bodies and placed upon the sick and lame who were then healed. Also, an angel 'troubled the waters' at a pool and the first one in got healed. Also, the woman touched 'the hem of His garment'.

But I would be very cautious about intentionally seeking to recreate those or similar things...

Have you read Nee's 'The Spiritual Man'? I think I asked you once before but don't recall if you said you had or not.

As for the "darkside"... is it possible that the children of this world are often more wise and well versed in the metaphysics of the spiritual than the children of the Kingdom? Remember... even though Moses turned his staff into a serpent through the "power" of faith... the sorcerers serving Pharaoh did the same thing. The question isn't so much as to if the energy or power exists... the question is... who is it being used to serve and to what purpose? God's man brought forth a serpent that overcame the serpents brought forth by the sorcerers. God's messages, miracles, and prophesies will always overcome those of the darkside.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I did read it a long time ago. It was a good read.

I must ask... Why should one be cautious about intentionally seeking to recreate those similar things? Is it out of "fear" of something? Fear isn't faith. And God hasn't given us a spirit of fear. The church can't move forward and do the "greater works" as promised if we fear stepping out and just doing them and letting the chips fall where they may.

I urge caution because one may inadvertently wind up practicing witchcraft, divination, whatever you wanna call it, while thinking they are doing 'spiritual, holy Ghost-led activities'.

I have seen it happen firsthand, and the end results aren't pretty.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

I urge caution because one may inadvertently wind up practicing witchcraft, divination, whatever you wanna call it, while thinking they are doing 'spiritual, holy Ghost-led activities'.

I have seen it happen firsthand, and the end results aren't pretty.

I've seen it happen too. And yes... I also believe that one should be cautious. Cautious... but not fearful of growing spiritually.

I also consider this... Satan can't create anything or generate power. Satan has nothing original to work with. Technically... in some manner... it's all "of God". Again... the question is: Who is being served? What is the purpose of the usage of this power?

I'm reminded of the old joke wherein an atheist professes that now he can create life from dirt. God then tells him... "Find your own dirt." lol

[Esaias]

I have walked the occult side of the aisle, and I have walked in the Light. And there is a major difference between the two, though to the inexperienced they may seem nearly identical or indistinguishable.

There is a lot of witchcraft/occultism being practiced and promoted among modern christians in the name of spirituality. This of course is nothing new, really, but there it is.

When I hear you talking about 'not needing text on it', about 'conversing with your guarding angel through impressions', about judging tongues and interpretations through subjective 'feelings' , and now about 'divine energies being placed into or upon physical objects' and 'taking it to the next level', alarm bells go off inside because all this is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO very familiar....from long ago.... and it wasn't from God.

I keep hearing 'personal inspiration', 'familiar spirits', 'clairvoyant divination', 'talismans and energy transference'...

Not saying that is definitely what is going on, or that you have fallen off the deep end. But when left to ourselves to judge our spirituality, especially when we are 'stepping outside the text', we place ourselves at a much greater chance of being deceived.

There is no fear (other than reverential fear of God) in seeking to be used by God's Spirit. But there is great need for 'fear' of being deceived into falling prey to seducing spirits. They don't show up claiming to be 'demons from hell', they 'appear' to us as 'angels of light' and as 'ministers of righteousness'.

Just saying.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Technically... in some manner... it's all "of God".

I would challenge that thought. God did not forbid divination 'unless it is serving God and being used for good'.

There is no 'white magick'.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

I would challenge that thought. God did not forbid divination 'unless it is serving God and being used for good'.

There is no 'white magick'.

Divination is a form of idolatry. It glorifies false gods and teachings. Also... it is rooted in cards, Ouija boards, crystals, and a lot of other junk that was related to false gods.

However...

In the OT we do have prophets and seers who were gifted and sought out by many for a word of prophesy. We see the Urim and Thummim. We also see "casting lots" to determine divine will. We see "astrologers" that depict the message of the heavens, which utter knowledge both day and night. We see prophets and seers interpret dreams, visions, voices, etc. Of course the prophet and the seer are essentially the same thing. However, they both have a distinctly different role and function.

We have to remind ourselves... everything in Satan's arsenal is a copy of something originally employed by God. Satan is a counterfeiter. He's never all that original. Even the Zodiac is holy... if it's understood as God intended it to be. It's even mentioned in Scripture as the, Mazzaroth. It's original purpose was to foretell and prophetically explain future events relating to the Gospel. However, Satan has twisted it up to some how depict outlooks for individuals and private matters like finances and one's love life. Daneil and the Magi used it correctly. Here's a link to the Mazzaroth's actual message:

http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...1&d=1332868677

The lesser constellations can even become more descriptive. Essentially... the major themes of the entire Bible are slowly turning above our heads for all to see. An interesting read can be found at this link:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Witness-St...l+in+the+Stars

Psalm 19:1-3 (KJV)
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.