Question About Submission

[MarieA27]

Originally Posted by Sasha

Marie, perhaps you are different, but most women want to look nice when in public. It's no different than men either, really. You can ask the same question of them, like, why the hair goup, why neckties and suits, and why so much cologne?

The 'legalistic' talk isn't about the wearing of these things alone, but when they are made to be salvational issues. That's a problem with God.

So...if you don't wear make-up, get your nails and hair done up, wear jewelry, put on cologne or perform, use all kind of hair accessories and products etc., then you don't look "nice"? Can you look nice without these things? Are you unattractive if you don't put any of these extra things on? After you put on decent clothing to cover your nakedness, what's the reason for the extras?

[MarieA27]

Originally Posted by Sasha

Marie, perhaps you are different, but most women want to look nice when in public. It's no different than men either, really. You can ask the same question of them, like, why the hair goup, why neckties and suits, and why so much cologne?

The 'legalistic' talk isn't about the wearing of these things alone, but when they are made to be salvational issues. That's a problem with God.

Really? It's funny how you all say that...

I think that when a lot of these rules were put down, there was a unified reason for them, now as time went along, people forgot the reason why, and just started saying that so and so was going to hell if they do such and such a thing, with out understanding why.

To me, a lot of these standards aren't sin in and of itself, but the reason why you would want to do such and such a thing.

But anyway, carry on...

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by MarieA27

So...if you don't wear make-up, get your nails and hair done up, wear jewelry, put on cologne or perform, use all kind of hair accessories and products etc., then you don't look "nice"? Can you look nice without these things? Are you unattractive if you don't put any of these extra things on? After you put on decent clothing to cover your nakedness, what's the reason for the extras?

Marie, perhaps you and I aren't seeing the picture the same.

Does it matter if I just brush my hair or is it ok that I put a barrette in it? What about putting it in a bun? Can I add a feather? Does any of this make a difference as to my intentions once I leave my home?

Can I put in the set of earrings my husband got me for my birthday, or should I feel like a floozy because I want to look nice and feel good?

I could just use the smell test when I wake up in the morning and, if my clothing doesn't show any dirt I can just keep wearing them over and over, but you know, I love the scent of vanilla musk. Should I feel bad for wanting to smell good?

Seriously, do I need a reason to have 'extras' on?

Marie, do you use a mirror?

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by MarieA27

Really? It's funny how you all say that...

I think that when a lot of these rules were put down, there was a unified reason for them, now as time went along, people forgot the reason why, and just started saying that so and so was going to hell if they do such and such a thing, with out understanding why.

To me, a lot of these standards aren't sin in and of itself, but the reason why you would want to do such and such a thing.

But anyway, carry on...

Marie, there was a time when listening to the radio, wearing red, and ladies wearing open toed shoes was considered 'wrong'. So now I have to ask, why do you NOW do those things?

[*AQuietPlace*]

Originally Posted by Mrsnt

So in my mind, this issue is about way more than just what I "want" to do. It's about my identity and being able to be true to what I believe. I want to obey the heart of God's message on true holiness, true modesty, true womanliness. Not just the outward show of it all...

I feel suffocated. I feel like I'm being asked to live a double life. What am I supposed to tell people who ask me why I dress the way I do? What am I telling people about myself when they see the way I look?

So this is a big issue for me on many levels...

I want to do what is RIGHT, not just what I WANT. I want to know the TRUTH.

Mrsnt - I know E.X.A.C.T.L.Y. what you are going through and how you feel. I went through the exact same thing.

It's not as easy as - 'oh, following the standards is no big deal, so just do it, even if you don't agree'. Not at all. It goes so much deeper than that. I struggled with it all for so long that I began to feel like I was going insane. I also slipped into a very deep depression.

P.M. me if you'd like to talk privately. I can share my journey with you.

[Sasha]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

Mrsnt - I know E.X.A.C.T.L.Y. what you are going through and how you feel. I went through the exact same thing.

It's not as easy as - 'oh, following the standards is no big deal, so just do it, even if you don't agree'. Not at all. It goes so much deeper than that. I struggled with it all for so long that I began to feel like I was going insane. I also slipped into a very deep depression.

P.M. me if you'd like to talk privately. I can share my journey with you.

I agree with you. It's just not that simple. It's akin to people who give advice to 'pray about it' when seeking advice or sympathy about a life changing situation.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Sasha

I agree with you. It's just not that simple. It's akin to people who give advice to 'pray about it' when seeking advice or sympathy about a life changing situation.

When we left the biggest thing my wife struggled with were the standards. It took her almost 6 months to finally lay them down.

[houston]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

When we left the biggest thing my wife struggled with were the standards. It took her almost 6 months to finally lay them down.

that was a quick transition

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by houston

that was a quick transition

She saw people worshiping God and loving God who were wearing pants and makeup.

[Sasha]

It took me longer than that. In fact, the change was in my heart long before it showed on the outside. Of course, since that happened, I'm no longer saved anyway.

The biggest thing for me to accept was attending a church that believed as I did. Sound strange? Understand that I was used to the UPC way of life, and even though I'd changed, it was difficult to realize there were others like me. It took a while for me to stop focusing on the women wearing pants on the platform and put my eyes on Jesus. All my life I'd been taught to judge people by how they looked, and it's hard to change that kind of thinking very quick. I still struggle, I admit.

I do watch in awe now at people who love God in spite of what they are wearing. God doesn't care, why should I?