Survival is really the root of all evil

[Adam]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

If you are presenting this as a scenario with Christians being in both group A and B, then the group who didn't share what they had with their fellow man would not be following the second commandment of Christ.

By not sharing, their survival instincts kicked in--which is the root of that evil deed.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Adam

By not sharing, their survival instincts kicked in--which is the root of that evil deed.

But what is money but the representation of the power to purchase and/or have things?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by ILG

I left the workforce this year but I still get paid in dollars. LOL! I think your thinking is a bit off.



Issuing dollars as debt as a government is not the problem. The problem is that it is not the government that is issuing dollars as debt...it is the federal reserve and the taxpayers must pay interest on that debt ro PRIVATE BANKERS who create dollars out of thin air for their own personal profit. THAT is what the problem is. If the government cut the private bankers out of the equation and issued the dollars itself in order to expand and contract the money supply that would be a different story.

wow; and you think my thinking is off?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Luke

I am going to go out on a limb and guess that you do not hold to aliteral interpretation of scripture but rather more of a spiritualization of scripture.

Do you consider yourself to be a dispensationalist?

No--but i don't know what that means, either...

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Excellent economic lesson!

I'm wondering if shazeep is referring to bartering... which is working for something in order to get something else in return, without the exchange of a dollar bill. I would see that as a worthwhile thing to do.

Well, see that that is what a note that is not issued as a debt instrument--by anyone--is meant to be. All this yack about 'it would be ok if the Gov issued the debt instrument' is completely naive, wadr; "Money issued as debt" is the very best definition of 'slavery' that i can think of! You are robbed every single day that you have a dollar in your pocket; and i would say also complicit in the murders required to keep the $ floating.

Understand (the lesson of Lincoln, first) why a lawful government will never issue a debt instrument, at least 'at interest.' Ever. This exact concept is what lawful governments are formed to combat. It is the reason for the War of 1812. It explains most, if not all, of the last several assassinations. Etc, ad nauseum, yikes.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Very true indeed. In some situations bartering works, but as our society is driven by the $ bill... would be very tough to live off what you could come by through bartering.

Ah--but a Christian is commanded to 'come out' of that society? Or at least, i took that one literally...and it's as hard as any other new habit, really. Tough the first couple of years, i guess; but the internet has made it pretty easy, actually.

[obriencp]

very interesting thread. I think I understand where the OP was going.

We've discussed money, love of money, selfishness, and survival instincts.

Money is a tool we all use to get things for survival. If we amass too many things we're considered by many as selfish. But doesn't being selfish stem from a survival instinct to ensure we, individually, survive regardless of what our fellow man is going through?

I wonder if our survival instinct traces back to when man fell and was no longer afforded access to the tree of life? God certainly placed that tree there as well as the tree of knowledge of good and evil. It was his plan that man would fall. Was it also his plan that the strong, intelligent, and genetically superior would survive? Otherwise we'd all have died off before Jesus came to redeem us and give us a choice of serving God.

Once salvation was poured out we have the option of: a. seeking out our own means of survival - or - b. seeking the kingdom of God and his righteousness. If we choose B, we ultimately deny our survival insticts and trust in God to provide.

^that may be a little far out, but I was thinking out loud regarding survival.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by obriencp

very interesting thread. I think I understand where the OP was going.

We've discussed money, love of money, selfishness, and survival instincts.

Money is a tool we all use to get things for survival. If we amass too many things we're considered by many as selfish. But doesn't being selfish stem from a survival instinct to ensure we, individually, survive regardless of what our fellow man is going through?

I wonder if our survival instinct traces back to when man fell and was no longer afforded access to the tree of life? God certainly placed that tree there as well as the tree of knowledge of good and evil. It was his plan that man would fall. Was it also his plan that the strong, intelligent, and genetically superior would survive? Otherwise we'd all have died off before Jesus came to redeem us and give us a choice of serving God.

Once salvation was poured out we have the option of: a. seeking out our own means of survival - or - b. seeking the kingdom of God and his righteousness. If we choose B, we ultimately deny our survival insticts and trust in God to provide.

^that may be a little far out, but I was thinking out loud regarding survival.

You know, I guess what you have to say makes sense, and I am beginning to see what Adam was trying to say.

Perhaps the love of money does come from the desire to survive and excel. When we set aside those earthly ambitions to instead trust God, the dollar bill does not seem as important as it did before. Interesting!

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by shazeep

Ah--but a Christian is commanded to 'come out' of that society? Or at least, i took that one literally...and it's as hard as any other new habit, really. Tough the first couple of years, i guess; but the internet has made it pretty easy, actually.

How is it working for you, to not live by the almighty $ ?

[Esaias]

Quite a lot of people do not have anything approaching a 'survival instinct'. I see them all the time at Wal-Mart.

The love of money is the love and desire for the ability to obtain the things that satisfy one's desires. Money means you can buy stuff, things and services. Money means you are respected and not considered a bum or a pauper. Money means you don't have to depend on other people to meet your needs or wants.

The love of money is selfishness, and is the root of all evil - ie selfishness is the root of all things.

Of course, there is a textual/translation issue with the specific passage as well, but...