Question primarily for pastors - Page 4

Jermyn Davidson · #31 09-22-2014, 09:00 AM

I would say the person is out of the will of God but the answer isn't to simply do more ministry stuff.

The answer is to seek the Face of God so that the person can see where they messed up and learn from this very hard situation.

The other answer would be to pray for God's Mercy, provision, and wisdom so that one doesn't make the same mistakes all over again.

The situations may be out of that person's control, but God is definitely trying to get that person's attention and it might be that the person did nothing wrong (like Job), but I doubt it.

Jermyn Davidson · #32 09-22-2014, 09:10 AM

In my life, when I have found myself in nearly impossible life situations, God gives me a moment of clarity so that I can see where I messed up, see the bad decision, or even the lack of faith. His discipline is not abusive.

God is a Good Father. If a person is being disciplined by God for past decisions, God will show them the reason why. If we need to learn, our Father is the greatest teacher.

If a person is in an impossible situation, our Father will make the way for us.

Our Father loves us.

Esphes45 · #33 09-22-2014, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Let's say there was a family in your church that was really struggling with basics like keeping the lights on and buying gasoline. They have one car and miss about every other Wednesday night simply because they cannot afford the gas as they live about 13 miles from the church. The are dedicated Christians but simply are having a difficult time. With their hardships they do good just to get to church Sundays and most Wednesdays but simply cannot afford to participate in off night ministries or functions. As a result of the hardships the father has to get a second part time job just to stay afloat and to be able to provide a meager Christmas for his kids. This eats up most of his time and eliminates his participation on off night ministry even more.

Would you say this person is out of the will of God somehow?

Should he just dive into all the extra off night functions at church and trust trust God to supply the gas and meet his needs instead of getting another job? Is he "not putting the Kingdom first" if he has to work two jobs? Or is God trying to tell him its time to move to an areas where better work is available?

I knew a man who was an unpaid associate pastor at a church. He and his family lost everything during a hurricane. They both worked but could not catch up. He did not get a second job because he would not have been able to continue to carry the load at church he normally did. He finally had to declare bankruptcy. Now if he had, for a season, curtailed some of his ministry involvement to work a second job, his pastor would have not been happy (I know him). Yet this man ends up having to declare bankruptcy. He refused to curtail any "ministry" activity even for a season in order to remain "faithful". Wouldn't it have been more noble and godly to get a second job for just a season?

I know I am late on this but I wanted to respond to the original question. Please let's get one thing straight, going to a building and participating in functions will not get us to heaven.

Quote:

Should he just dive into all the extra off night functions at church and trust trust God to supply the gas and meet his needs instead of getting another job? Is he "not putting the Kingdom first" if he has to work two jobs? Or is God trying to tell him its time to move to an areas where better work is available?

God knows his heart. The man should focus on his bills.

You can't praise/worship God when debt is hanging over your head.
You can't give toward the work of the Lord when debt is hanging over your head. This is why the bible tells us to owe no man. Declaring bankruptcy to me is not right. I understand people have to do what they have to do. I'm not going to judge his lifestyle, that is between him and God.

Like someone said All churches care about is Tithes and Attendance. It is sad but true.

Esphes45 · #34 09-22-2014, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seguidordejesus

I believe if a man doesn't provide for his family (as much as it is within his power), he is worse than an unbeliever. If finances only allow Sunday and occasional Wednesday attendance, I wouldn't fault him at all. He'd be better off spending Wednesdays with his family in a private prayer meeting and saving the gas money for an emergency fund.

If that is truly all you can do in that area with your skill set, I would really encourage you to move somewhere else.

KeptByTheWord · #35 09-23-2014, 05:32 PM

The Apostle Paul didn't have a family, as far as we know. He lived his life sold out completely to the cause of Christ. Yet, he admonished those who had families that if they did not take care of their families, they were worse than infidels.

Let the Lord lead and guide wherever it may be.

votivesoul · #36 09-24-2014, 11:23 AM

Deuteronomy 15:11,

Quote:

For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and to thy needy, in thy land.

1 John 3:17,

Quote:

But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?

Any pastor should know and practice these verses as commandments of the Lord.

To do less means such a person isn't much more than a "brutish" pastor, and will have their flocks scattered by the Lord (Jeremiah 10:21).

And why? Because God doesn't want His saints being shepherded by such people, since all they do is feed themselves.

See Ezekiel 34:1-16 and let such a passage terrify any "pastor" who doesn't love and care for God's sheep the way He commands.

KeptByTheWord · #37 09-27-2014, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Deuteronomy 15:11,

1 John 3:17,

Any pastor should know and practice these verses as commandments of the Lord.

To do less means such a person isn't much more than a "brutish" pastor, and will have their flocks scattered by the Lord (Jeremiah 10:21).

And why? Because God doesn't want His saints being shepherded by such people, since all they do is feed themselves.

See Ezekiel 34:1-16 and let such a passage terrify any "pastor" who doesn't love and care for God's sheep the way He commands.

Very true words, Bro.

Abiding Now · #38 09-27-2014, 04:38 PM

I'm know of several circumstances where a person got in financial trouble, needed help and the church/pastor came to their rescue. I also know of folks that got THEMSELVES in all kinds of a mess over and over, then wanted to blame the church and the preacher because they didn't bail them out. You can't fix stooopid.

DaveC519 · #39 09-27-2014, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Let's say there was a family in your church that was really struggling with basics like keeping the lights on and buying gasoline. They have one car and miss about every other Wednesday night simply because they cannot afford the gas as they live about 13 miles from the church. The are dedicated Christians but simply are having a difficult time. With their hardships they do good just to get to church Sundays and most Wednesdays but simply cannot afford to participate in off night ministries or functions. As a result of the hardships the father has to get a second part time job just to stay afloat and to be able to provide a meager Christmas for his kids. This eats up most of his time and eliminates his participation on off night ministry even more.

Would you say this person is out of the will of God somehow?

Should he just dive into all the extra off night functions at church and trust trust God to supply the gas and meet his needs instead of getting another job? Is he "not putting the Kingdom first" if he has to work two jobs? Or is God trying to tell him its time to move to an areas where better work is available?

I knew a man who was an unpaid associate pastor at a church. He and his family lost everything during a hurricane. They both worked but could not catch up. He did not get a second job because he would not have been able to continue to carry the load at church he normally did. He finally had to declare bankruptcy. Now if he had, for a season, curtailed some of his ministry involvement to work a second job, his pastor would have not been happy (I know him). Yet this man ends up having to declare bankruptcy. He refused to curtail any "ministry" activity even for a season in order to remain "faithful". Wouldn't it have been more noble and godly to get a second job for just a season?

I'd like to respond to the question I've highlighted in red above with ANOTHER question:

"What are the chances that a group of posters on a message forum would be able to determine whether someone they had never met was actually in the will of God or not?"

ANSWER: 0%

(everybody still love me?)

Michael The Disciple · #40 09-27-2014, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveC519

I'd like to respond to the question I've highlighted in red above with ANOTHER question:

"What are the chances that a group of posters on a message forum would be able to determine whether someone they had never met was actually in the will of God or not?"

ANSWER: 0%

(everybody still love me?)

Well we are limited to speaking about generalities when it comes to personal issues.