The Appeal of Preterism

[shazeep]

I think it's only natural to seek a definitive answer to (deliberately ambiguous) questions like these because they are foremost in others' minds, and what we may feel we are being implicitly called upon to answer definitively; when the nature of the question itself, it's uselessness in the moment (plus the fact that it is what everyone wants to know), precedes here.

While appearing to be an important question, it becomes merely a trap, a red herring. Forcing you to take A Position defined by Some Guys, that some Other Guys disagree with, which should be your biggest clue. It divides you. It has no other purpose, imo.

[Bowas]

Originally Posted by Lafon

Mike, if you will but carefully examine an outline of the city limits of Jerusalem at the time of Christ, you'll find that the place "where also our Lord was crucified" was NOT within its boundaries, rather the site of Calvary was northeast of the city.

Moreover, the phrase "street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt," should be recognized as speaking of the "whole world," for it will be there, scattered in every place imaginable, that the slain saints of the coming Anti-Christ and his deceived followers, will be found when God allows him to "make war with the saints and overcome them" during the last days.

Now I know that you, as an advocate of preterist doctrine do not accept this as truth, but I write and post this for the sake of those of us who do believe in the prophecy which tells of the coming of this "man of sin" and of his "war" with the saints.

Please provide scripture to substanciate your claim that "the great city should be recognized as speaking of the whole world."
I have never heard that and seems to be a stretch to which I cannot see a reason for it not to be Jerusalem. True, it occcured just outside the city limits, but still was considered Jerusalems crucificion place, right?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Bowas

Please provide scripture to substanciate your claim that "the great city should be recognized as speaking of the whole world."
I have never heard that and seems to be a stretch to which I cannot see a reason for it not to be Jerusalem. True, it occcured just outside the city limits, but still was considered Jerusalems crucificion place, right?

I think the city here is speaking of modern day Jerusalem. It spiritually is just like Sodom and Egypt today. It is filled with sinners, unbelievers and endless various types of faiths today. It fits the description to the "T" today!

[Bowas]

Originally Posted by Sean

I think the city here is speaking of modern day Jerusalem. It spiritually is just like Sodom and Egypt today. It is filled with sinners, unbelievers and endless various types of faiths today. It fits the description to the "T" today!

Why, may I ask, would it be "modern day Jerusalem?" It, to me, is obvious it is speaking of Jerusalem, as you agree, but the Jerusalem of today has no inhabitants that was around during Jesus' time to warrant this kind of punishment and none today are any more guilty of His death, than any other group of peoples today.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Bowas

Why, may I ask, would it be "modern day Jerusalem?" It, to me, is obvious it is speaking of Jerusalem, as you agree, but the Jerusalem of today has no inhabitants that was around during Jesus' time to warrant this kind of punishment and none today are any more guilty of His death, than any other group of peoples today.

Ahhh. Yes.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Bowas

Why, may I ask, would it be "modern day Jerusalem?" It, to me, is obvious it is speaking of Jerusalem, as you agree, but the Jerusalem of today has no inhabitants that was around during Jesus' time to warrant this kind of punishment and none today are any more guilty of His death, than any other group of peoples today.

It was ONLY describing the CRUCIFIXION area, not blaming them for it...




7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Sean

It was ONLY describing the CRUCIFIXION area, not blaming them for it...


7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

Matthew 23: 34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

[houston]

I think it's Exeter, not Jerusalem.

[Bowas]

Originally Posted by Bowas

Why, may I ask, would it be "modern day Jerusalem?" It, to me, is obvious it is speaking of Jerusalem, as you agree, but the Jerusalem of today has no inhabitants that was around during Jesus' time to warrant this kind of punishment and none today are any more guilty of His death, than any other group of peoples today.

Originally Posted by Sean

[/U]





It was ONLY describing the CRUCIFIXION area, not blaming them for it...




7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

Keep reading...
Verse 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Bowas

Keep reading...
Verse 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

Sure...that earthquake, etc., was not because of the crucifixion, but because they slew the 2 modern day tribulation prophets....