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10-27-2014, 11:26 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,945
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
Yea there is NO SCRIPTURE in the Bible where ANYONE knew God the Father when it was not Jesus Christ!
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For me its plain. The Rock of Israel is YHVH the creator, the Father, the Great and Mighty and Terrible God. And Paul said that Rock is Christ (the man who died and rose again)!
Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. And he is also our Great God and Saviour. Glory to his name!
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10-28-2014, 12:35 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 14,650
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by Esaias
For me its plain. The Rock of Israel is YHVH the creator, the Father, the Great and Mighty and Terrible God. And Paul said that Rock is Christ (the man who died and rose again)!
Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. And he is also our Great God and Saviour. Glory to his name!
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Yes he is both the Father and the Son! Altogether glorious!
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10-28-2014, 01:23 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 9,001
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by good samaritan
The bible is what I use and to save any confusion I use the KJV only when debating, teaching, and preaching. I don't go by ideas I go by what it says. When someone dies they cease to live. God never ceased to live. Christ's humanity was what died not the eternal Spirit of Jesus. The bible teaches that Christ was tempted in all points, but in James it says that God cannot tempted.
If you believe the scripture is true that God cannot be tempted than you cannot believe the flesh is God or else you would have a contradiction.
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The wise Christian admits it was God that was tempted! Why? For if God was not tempted then he who was tempted was not God. He who was tempted was Jesus.
You can't have your cake and it eat too  If Jesus is God then God was tempted. If God was not tempted then Jesus was not God. Take your pick, but beware the consequences.
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You better watch out before I blitzkrieg your thread cause I'm the Thread Nazi now!
Last edited by jfrog; 10-28-2014 at 01:36 AM.
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10-28-2014, 02:12 AM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by good samaritan
The bible is what I use and to save any confusion I use the KJV only when debating, teaching, and preaching. I don't go by ideas I go by what it says. When someone dies they cease to live. God never ceased to live. Christ's humanity was what died not the eternal Spirit of Jesus. The bible teaches that Christ was tempted in all points, but in James it says that God cannot tempted.
If you believe the scripture is true that God cannot be tempted than you cannot believe the flesh is God or else you would have a contradiction.
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Its what we all use
The bible teaches concepts, ideas. Whatever it says is what that concept or idea is.
Is Christ God? Did Christ die?
When a person dies, their body ceases to function.
Nobody says his skin was God.
That's weird.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-28-2014, 02:16 AM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by Esaias
If Jesus is God, and Jesus died, then God died. NOBODY I know of believes God died AS GOD. We all believe God died AS MAN. That is to say, the One who died, the MAN who was crucified, is in fact the Supreme Deity, YHVH, incarnate.
The only reason people get their knickers in a bind when this statement is made is because they have a need to make sure we don't exalt Jesus "too much". Thus we see "oneness" people so-called wanting us to tone it down and "focus more on the humanity" aspect.
And ANY theology which results in "keeping Jesus in his place" is suspect imo.
Yes the Father is greater than the Son and the Son came from thr Father. But JESUS IS THE FATHER. AND THE SON. AND THE HOLY GHOST.
All this effort to "update" our theology will lead to a destination most here can't see and would probably reject if the could see it.
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They don't believe God died as a man. They believe flesh died...whatever that means
This confusion, I believe, is the result of refusing to categorize things into Person and Nature.
Who and What
Who died? God
What died? His human body
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-28-2014, 02:24 AM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
Is He who died the same He who Eternally existed as God? Or is HE who died someone OTHER than God?
Is He who was tempted the same HE who created everything as God? Or is He who was tempted someone OTHER than He who created everything?
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-28-2014, 06:53 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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Originally Posted by Praxeas
Sounds like two persons. One is God and the other is not, but then you contradict that by saying the Man is the Father....because the Father is inside of the man..which in itself sounds nonsensical.
Is the Son a Person? And is that Person the same one as the Father?
Is the Son just a body?
Is the Son God? Or just a man? Or just a body?
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It depends on how one defines "person". Let's start where we know we agree. There is only one "divine person", that is the Father, aka God.
The human being (the man) Jesus Christ is the express image of God's own person in full humanity. Therefore, He is the perfect reflection of the Father's own person. Because of this we can say that we see the person of the Father in Him. But there is a distinction. In Christ there is a distinct human mind, a human will, human spirit. He's not just a body.
From conception, this full humanity was inseparably one with the Father. This means that there is an unexplainable and inseparable union of the divine essence with the human essence. Therefore, through this union each nature partakes in the very essence of the other. Thus, in Christ, God becomes man... and that man was born being a man... but also God.
No analogy is perfect. But I have tried to explain it by saying, imagine that we have two half full wine glasses. One has wine... the other has water. Now, let's pour them together into one glass. What is in the filled glass, wine or water? Both. God poured Himself into the zygote that became the man Jesus Christ. What therefore is this man, is He man or God? Both.
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10-28-2014, 07:55 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 23,543
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
Jesus is God.
Jesus died...
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God died? Please explain
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10-28-2014, 08:18 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2,710
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfrog
The wise Christian admits it was God that was tempted! Why? For if God was not tempted then he who was tempted was not God. He who was tempted was Jesus.
You can't have your cake and it eat too If Jesus is God then God was tempted. If God was not tempted then Jesus was not God. Take your pick, but beware the consequences. |
Quote:
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James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
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A wise christian will never reject the scripture. As far as having my cake and eating it too I don't know what you mean? There isn't any selfish motives in why I believe oneness the way I do. If the Bible taught the trinity (which it doesn't) then I would be arguing a different case.
Jesus is God in the flesh and He is seated on the throne for all eternity and that is backed up by scripture. Jesus is God revealed to all mankind. One day every shall bow and every tongue shall confess.
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10-28-2014, 08:23 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2,710
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Re: Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Fathe
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1 John 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
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flesh=son
spirit=father
I am not uncomfortable to use terminology Jesus the son of God are you?
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