Circumcision of the heart

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Esaias

So then they are in error who say one is uncircumcised until they receive the Spirit?

Some people read "baptism" as spirit baptism in all of the epistles.

[shazeep]

i'd like to suggest a definition of 'baptism' as more accurately 'being immersed in the waters;' with all of the relevant metaphor--'waters' being a metaphor for the great unwashed, etc. Our little ceremonial dunkings notwithstanding. Much.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Some people read "baptism" as spirit baptism in all of the epistles.

Context in comparison with known verses that obviously speak of water and say the same thing, in turn say otherwise.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Repentance and baptism does the removal and cleansing. Spirit infilling does the new creating. God did not have the cleanse Adam before he was created.

There is no literal cleansing in baptism either.
Baptism is us demonstrating to God that we are surrendering that which needs cleansing and rebirth.

[Esaias]

New covenant circumcision is the removal or putting off of "the body of sins". Seems it is therefore tied to repentance and baptism in the name of the Lord.

In regards to the cleansing work of the Spirit, I believe Peter said of Cornelius and company that when they received the Spirit God had "purified their hearts by faith". So there seems to be a heart cleansing effect of genuine Holy Ghost baptism.

Could it be that, just like with the ideas of justification and sanctification, we have nowadays split apart what Biblically is united in the whole conversion experience process?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Originalist

There is no literal cleansing in baptism either.
Baptism is us demonstrating to God that we are surrendering that which needs cleansing and rebirth.

However our faith in out baptism into His death causes and moves God to commit an actual operation in removing the sins body of the sins of the flesh. That's what Col 2:11-12 flatly states. Our faith in the operation of God occurs while we are baptized. So, it's really both.

[Luke]

Circumcision of the heart is the removal of the adamic/carnal/nature.
This is accomplished at the point of entire sanctification which is post salvation. That the old man (the carnal nature) is not removed at salvation is obvious in scripture:

And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. — 1 Corinthians 3:1 (KJV)

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? — 1 Corinthians 3:3 (KJV)

That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; — Ephesians 4:22 (KJV)

And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; — Ephesians 4:23 (KJV)

And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness. — Ephesians 4:24 (KJV)

For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. — Galatians 5:17 (KJV)

[shazeep]

Nice. Tho i much prefer "...may not do..." over "cannot" in that last one. Where is the lexicon on that site, btw? ty.
Ans Esaias, good stuff!

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by mfblume

However our faith in out baptism into His death causes and moves God to commit an actual operation in removing the sins body of the sins of the flesh. That's what Col 2:11-12 flatly states. Our faith in the operation of God occurs while we are baptized. So, it's really both.

I submit that it happens as a result of our baptism but not necessarily simultaneously with it.

[Luke]

The result of heart circumcision is the enabling of God to live free of sin, a pure heart, and Christian perfection. All of these things are from God none are attained through human effort. All of these are made possible by the death of Jesus through faith. Notice the following passages:

Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. — Romans 6:6 (KJV)

And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. — 1 Thessalonians 5:23 (KJV)
Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it. — 1 Thessalonians 5:24 (KJV)

And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;
Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. — Acts 26:15-18 (KJV)

And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; — Acts 15:8 (KJV)
And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. — Acts 15:9 (KJV)

Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. — 2 Peter 1:4 (KJV)

For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God. — Hebrews 7:19 (KJV)

For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. — Hebrews 10:14 (KJV)

Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate. — Hebrews 13:12 (KJV)

Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. — Hebrews 13:20-21