Why I Am A Futurist - Page 68

mfblume · #**671** 03-07-2015, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

a very good Q. I'm totally guessing @ "rebound/repentance," which would have awarded him forgiveness?

That does not answer my question. Let me clarify it. What was the fruit of Life for before Adam sinned?

shazeep · #**672** 03-07-2015, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

You mentioned mythology. Shazeep, Jesus and his miracles are also considered mythology by some. It's not mythology.

ok, well that is also a loaded word, and in Christ's case they are trying to make "mythology" mean "myth." The two are not synonymous. We have other evidence in historical records for Christ's existence. Let the dead bury the dead.

shazeep · #**673** 03-07-2015, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

That does not answer my question. Let me clarify it. What was the fruit of Life for before Adam sinned?

well, the Q is asked from our perspective, to begin with--who says Adam "sinned?" Adam disobeyed God. Does a toddler who disobeys "sin?"

And see how the fruit of life, if it is rebound, is irrelevant to one who does not have knowledge of good and evil.

shazeep · #**674** 03-07-2015, 10:37 AM

Cain sinned, i guess. But not Adam, i don't think.

mfblume · #**675** 03-07-2015, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

ok, well that is also a loaded word, and in Christ's case they are trying to make "mythology" mean "myth." The two are not synonymous. We have other evidence in historical records for Christ's existence. Let the dead bury the dead.

So, are you saying mythology can be true history?

mfblume · #**676** 03-07-2015, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

well, the Q is asked from our perspective, to begin with--who says Adam "sinned?" Adam disobeyed God. Does a toddler who disobeys "sin?"

And see how the fruit of life, if it is rebound, is irrelevant to one who does not have knowledge of good and evil.

This issue started from the concept of immortality, what has it and what doesn't. And it has to be related to the point of the resurrection. Do you believe we shall gain immortal bodies at the resurrection? If so, then is that a restoration of what Adam had but lost? See what I mean? It's related somehow. Those who think there is a resurrection to render our physical bodies immortal but do not believe Adam had an immortal body before he sinned, have no connection with the resurrection and Adam's state to which we should be restored. Of course, this takes it for granted that ultimate goal for salvation when its fully complete is restoration to what Adam lost.

I cannot see where Adam was created to die and go to heaven.

shazeep · #**677** 03-07-2015, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

So, are you saying mythology can be true history?

definitely. Well, true pre-history. There are thesis' on the truths in Greek mythology, even. The "gods" are actually people, etc. We have only had writing for a few thousand years; and mass-printing for way less. Enduring mythology must, by simple process of elimination, contain distilled truth.

shazeep · #**678** 03-07-2015, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

This issue started from the concept of immortality, what has it and what doesn't. And it has to be related to the point of the resurrection. Do you believe we shall gain immortal bodies at the resurrection? If so, then is that a restoration of what Adam had but lost? See what I mean? It's related somehow. Those who think there is a resurrection to render our physical bodies immortal but do not believe Adam had an immortal body before he sinned, have no connection with the resurrection and Adam's state to which we should be restored. Of course, this takes it for granted that ultimate goal for salvation when its fully complete is restoration to what Adam lost.

I cannot see where Adam was created to die and go to heaven.

hmm. Did Adam eat? Why? Christ was sinless; would He have lived forever? Is 969 years some theoretical limit? Sin brings death, we are told--and surely someone will quote here in a minute that Adam sinned. Gotta eat lunch, i'll be back!

mfblume · #**679** 03-07-2015, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

hmm. Did Adam eat? Why? Christ was sinless; would He have lived forever? Is 969 years some theoretical limit? Sin brings death, we are told--and surely someone will quote here in a minute that Adam sinned. Gotta eat lunch, i'll be back!

Some say Christ died since He took our sin upon Himself.

Do you feel we shall experience a change in our physical bodies so they become immortal, according to 1 Cor 15?

shazeep · #**680** 03-07-2015, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Some say Christ died since He took our sin upon Himself.

Do you feel we shall experience a change in our physical bodies so they become immortal, according to 1 Cor 15?

well,
"44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly."

so to answer your Q, "no."