"Is it a Heaven or Hell Issue?"

[amh]

Okay, I don't know if it's just me, but whenever I hear this, I feel like the person who's asking is really saying, "What is the bare minimum I can do to have a relationship with God?"

Any thoughts? Not trying to offend anyone. Just wondering.

[Sean]

"Is it a Heaven or Hell Issue?"....oh brother!



Any false concept we may teach or believe is a HELL issue!


Who invented that saying anyway?

Jesus or the Apostles?


I used to say that also, then I read the Bible...LOL

[shazeep]

well, while it might be perceived as 'bare minimum,' it is most likely meant to indicate that there may be some higher principle at work there. ay least in the questioner's mind

[amh]

Originally Posted by shazeep

well, while it might be perceived as 'bare minimum,' it is most likely meant to indicate that there may be some higher principle at work there. ay least in the questioner's mind

"Am I gonna go to Hell if I get drunk tonight?"

"Well, no, but you know what the bible says about drunkenness..."

"Yeah, but it's not like I'm gonna DIE tonight. I can alays repent later..."

And then you're trying not to offend them so you just say, "Yeah, I guess..." when you're really thinking "the fact that you can repent later doesn't mean you should sin now."

[shazeep]

oh ya that's just straight hypocrisy lol

[Servant's <3]

People seem to think that everything is right or wrong.... When in reality, the motivation and heart behind why you are doing something is far more important. If you are asking if <insert whatever subject you like> is a heaven or hell issue... chances are very good you shouldnt be doing it.... The question should NEVER be will God forgive me for doing this or can I do this and still get into heaven.

The question should be does me doing this glorify God? Does it show others that Christ is working in me? Could it cause someone else to sin? If I do this am I being an example to others watching?

I'm not saying that anyone is perfect at doing this, but if we did it more often instead of making excuses like "God will forgive me for getting angry with my brother" instead of "I will show mercy and forgive my brother who has slighted me" (an example) think of the witness we could be...

The question shouldn't be "what is the bare minimum I can give and still be holy in God's or my pastor's or my eyes" but "am I doing everything I can to grow in my knowledge of God and take the relationship I have with him to another level."

"What is the bare minimum I can give to the homeless man and seem generous" or "What do I have in my wallet... 10... 20... 100.... do I NEED it?"

It comes down to love... if you claim to love God you shouldn't question how little you can do... but how much can you do?

Love says I will sacrifice for another. I will decrease so he can increase. I will set aside judgement and be merciful. I will forgive even if someone else doesn't forgive me. The bible does not call for quid pro quo... it calls for sacrifice... obedience... and above all LOVE.

1 Corinthians 13:1-8

Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not LOVE, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not LOVE, I am nothing.And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not LOVE, it profiteth me nothing. LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. LOVE never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

(I added all caps for Love and changed charity to love as that is what the verse means)

[good samaritan]

Charity IMO, is love in action and so I like the use of the word charity. I agree with you though.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by amh

Okay, I don't know if it's just me, but whenever I hear this, I feel like the person who's asking is really saying, "What is the bare minimum I can do to have a relationship with God?"

Any thoughts? Not trying to offend anyone. Just wondering.

Hmmm... the "bare minimum" demands the most spiritual introspection.

Romans 13:8-10 English Standard Version (ESV)
8 Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Galatians 5:14 English Standard Version (ESV)
14 For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

James 2:8 English Standard Version (ESV)
If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.

Are you living a life of love? Is your love for God being manifest in your love for others? Is love consuming your thoughts, words, and actions?

This path has no "standards" per se. However, it demands full spiritual focus and an ability to hear and feel the leading of the Holy Spirit in all things. This is a path for the spiritual Christian. The Christian who seeks to experience the power of Spirit over any other entrapment or system. A path many might see as the path of the Christian "mystic". A path that not only focuses strictly upon loving God and loving others... it is a path also focused upon experiencing the spiritual reality behind the union between our spirit and the abiding Holy Spirit. What it means to live as a "branch" of the true vine. What it means to live as an extension of God. What it means to be one spirit with the Lord.

This is the path that doesn't focus on standards. So some may call it the bare minimum. However, this "bare minimum" will require far more active attention and participation towards your spiritual development than merely obeying the standards. So in many ways it demands more.

To love. To live a life of love. To love God and demonstrate that love through one's love of others. To live in union with God.

This is the path wherein the bare minimum requires your all.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by amh

Okay, I don't know if it's just me, but whenever I hear this, I feel like the person who's asking is really saying, "What is the bare minimum I can do to have a relationship with God?"

Any thoughts? Not trying to offend anyone. Just wondering.

Right, I think you nailed it. So many people wanting to have a simple list of rules of dos and don'ts to follow and hoping they can make it in that way. Instead, following Jesus and being his disciple means being obedient and doing things that may not be labeled "sin" in someone else's mind, but for you it is. Following Jesus requires much more than just a to do or don't do list. It is about a relationship that is pleasing to GOD, and being willing to set aside whatever things in your life may be a hindrance - not necessarily even a sin - in order to have a closer relationship with the Lord.

[barry72]

The "is this a heaven or hell issue" questions is usually concerning standards. In that case, I always answer, NO. The sad reason that questions exists is because many ministers like to preach that it is.