Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferd
Anyone arguing for a man run government or legal system that is based on the laws of God does not understand God.
|
Anyone arguing against the Word of God is arguing in favour of sin, because 'sin is transgression of the law' ie rebellion against God's authority.
Quote:
|
The simple fact is, if every person alive obeyed the laws of God there would be no need for any government.
|
Pure nonsense. If your children walked in perfect obedience to you then
you would be unneeded, correct? God's government exists in heaven. Everyone in heaven obeys God at all times in all ways. So there is no need for God's government in heaven, correct? God's government will be established in this earth over all nations. There will come a time when there will be no more sin whatsoever, no more disobedience. All will be perfect. Will God's government cease to exist, or become unneeded? Of course not, such an idea is ridiculous.
Quote:
|
BUT the bible never suggests such a situation is even possible. The entire bible is explicit that there is a spiritual war taking place with evil and that evil is ever present.
|
The Bible says such a situation is not only possible, but commanded, and the lack of such a situation is SIN. The failure of government to obey God is SIN, it is the rebellion of the nations against God. There is indeed a spiritual war taking place, and the church's mission, should she choose to accept it, is to make known to the powers that be the manifold wisdom of God (ie his will). This is elementary, Bible 101, it IS the Gospel. For behold, the gospel is the Good News of the KINGDOM OF GOD, with Jesus Christ installed as KING and SOLE MONARCH, with an ekklesia (look it up) commissioned to TEACH ALL NATIONS TO OBEY ALL HIS COMMANDS. And why? Because our King, King Jesus, has been given ALL - A.L.L. - A...L...L... - authority, not just in heaven, but IN EARTH. He is the Supreme Power, the Highest Authority in the earth. To suggest otherwise is unchristian.
Quote:
|
The bible tells us that our enemy is NOT a carnal (in the flesh) enemy. Rather it is spiritual. "We wrestle not against flesh and blood..."
|
Nobody has suggested our 'enemy' is not spiritual. It has always been so. It must be so, by the very nature of the case. This is a straw man argument. You are saying 'our enemy is not fleshly, but spiritual, therefore Jesus is not supposed to reign over ALL mankind in ALL areas of life.' Sounds like enemy propaganda to me, you should quit listening to it.
Quote:
|
Further, government is that which seeks to control people. Paul suggests we "Identify with the sufferings of Christ". One cannot identify with the sufferings of Christ which included in no small part being persecuted by government, if WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT.
|
According to the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, and the fundamental laws of this nation, WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT already. 'We the People...' are the source of political authority in the United States. I think you are confused. Paul taught very clearly and in no uncertain terms that government is ordained for the purpose of punishing evil and rewarding good. Government is ACCOUNTABLE to God. Government that persecutes godliness and truth and rewards evil is in rebellion to God and faces his judgment and curse.
It was government that persecuted Christ and the early church, specifically the government of Judea. And Christ destroyed that government specifically for that reason. Now ask yourself, what is 'government'? Is it not PEOPLE? Yes, it is, it is PEOPLE. Are those people obligated to obey the gospel? Yes they are. And have been. And will be. Now, suppose the government PEOPLE of Judea - after having killed Messiah - suppose they REPENTED? And began to obey Christ's gospel? Would God be saying 'No, no no! You've got it all wrong! As government, you need to be evil and persecute my people!' Seriously? I mean, REALLY? You believe that nonsense?
Did not Paul teach that if Judea turned to God it would be 'life from the dead'? Why, yes he did, right there in Romans!
Quote:
|
Paul instructed over and over that the law we obey is written on the heart. NOT a law that is tangible. Paul clearly indicates that we are citizens of heaven NOT citizens of some earthly kingdom.
|
You are so close, but so far away.
What law is written on the heart?
And what do you mean 'not a law that is tangible'? that doesn't even make any sense. A law is a commandment, a rule of conduct. The law of GOD is what man is obligated to follow. The New Covenant is specifically given so that as individuals we can FULLY OBEY the law of God, as it says in Romans that Christ died so that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us who walk not after the flesh (rebellion) but after the Spirit (obedience).
But notice, the subject of this thread is CIVIL GOVERNMENT'S DUTY TO PUNISH EVIL in the fear of God.
Quote:
|
Any suggestion that Christians who do not desire an actual God based government aren't biblical is itself anti-biblica.
|
Balderdash. Any suggestion that Christians who support the Great Commission are unbiblical is unbiblical.
Quote:
|
You legislate, what GOD considers a matter of the hart. period. THAT itself is an Anti-Christ spirit.
|
I don't legislate anything. God has already legislated. THAT is the point you and all the other antinomians ignore. God considers it a matter of the heart, indeed. It is the 'heart of the matter'. It is the 'great controversy' between God and man. Who will we obey? God? Or man?
The antichrist spirit is denying that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. It is also denying the Son of God. What is the Son of God? Why, the MESSIAH, the KING that God has established to be heir of the world, king of ALL KINGS (ie governor of all governments). To deny Christ's authority as the Son of God over all mankind, all nations, all people, IS declared to be 'antichrist', by the Scripture.
good point.
Linear Mode
