Do you think Revelations is enigmatic?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The "seed of a woman" defeating the serpent was a prophecy of a virgin birth. This prophecy was fulfilled thousands of years after the time of its original recipients. Certainly every generation who understood the prophecy (to at least some degree) thought that it might be fulfilled in their day, though it wasn't. I don't see an issue.



Where does the Revelation offer a warning to those who misinterpret it? I do know of a warning against tampering with the text:

Revelation 22:18-19 English Standard Version (ESV)
18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book, 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

Thus protecting the text from being tampered with for future generations was seen as an absolute necessity. So important in fact, tampering with the text could cost one their soul.

Adding to and taking away isn't about just the text. If it was then we would all have to learn GREEK. Adding or taking away is telling a different story then was originally intended by the writer. Peter warns about this concerning the writings of Paul. Peter said the unstable and unlearned twist Paul's words as they do the rest of the scriptures. Even though Paul's words were hard to understand wasn't an excuse. You still couldn't remove his meanings or intent.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The "seed of a woman" defeating the serpent was a prophecy of a virgin birth. This prophecy was fulfilled thousands of years after the time of its original recipients. Certainly every generation who understood the prophecy (to at least some degree) thought that it might be fulfilled in their day, though it wasn't. I don't see an issue.

You aren't given any time specific language. No mention in Genesis that the time was near. Yet, you have that in the first chapter of the Revelation.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Adding to and taking away isn't about just the text. If it was then we would all have to learn GREEK. Adding or taking away is telling a different story then was originally intended by the writer.

I've read several works by Chilton, Sproul, Russel, Gentry, and Demar. They don't all agree on the story being told in Revelation. Who's going to Hell? Which Preterist's work is 100% accurate? Preterism is essentially eschatological Monday night quarterbacking. And nearly every Preterst I've met has a different angle, just like the Futurists I've met.

I contend that it is about tampering with the text. Yes, translations have to reward things to get the meaning of the original text. But the original Greek text wasn't to be tampered with.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Peter warns about this concerning the writings of Paul. Peter said the unstable and unlearned twist Paul's words as they do the rest of the scriptures. Even though Paul's words were hard to understand wasn't an excuse. You still couldn't remove his meanings or intent.

Now you're referencing an entirely different situation in Scripture, pulling from Peter, and then pulling from Paul. Each had unique concerns, important concerns, concerns regarding tampering with another's writings.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

You aren't given any time specific language. No mention in Genesis that the time was near. Yet, you have that in the first chapter of the Revelation.

Near is a relative term. To the LORD, a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as but a day. Only the Father knows the times appointed. It is written in a manner to keep us all on our toes and in preparation.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Now you're referencing an entirely different situation in Scripture, pulling from Peter, and then pulling from Paul. Each had unique concerns, important concerns, concerns regarding tampering with another's writings.

Aquila, Peter is talking about scripture being misinterpreted.

Period.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Amanah

everyone sees Rome as being the beast
* first century saints see Imperial Rome
* Reformation saints see The Roman Church
* most people today see a revived empire.

it seems like figuring this out is key.

Can the "beast" be the Roman Catholic Church and the Whore Babylon be America?

[TK Burk]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I contend that it is about tampering with the text. Yes, translations have to reward things to get the meaning of the original text. But the original Greek text wasn't to be tampered with.

Let me see if I'm getting this right, you contend that it's not about misinterpreting what is written, but instead not altering the actual wording in the document. is that right?

So, the epistle should be placed under glass with an alarm system to keep out any typos, but those who read the unaltered text can believe anything they wish? Is that what you believe?

Isn't that confusion? Isn't God not the author of such a mess?

Originally Posted by Aquila

Near is a relative term. To the LORD, a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as but a day. Only the Father knows the times appointed. It is written in a manner to keep us all on our toes and in preparation.

Relative to what? You have the Scripture being written so that it causes fear to be its motivating force. Isn't "fear" said to be a spirit that's not of God?

I agree that the original text should remain as written. But I also believe it was written so the righteous could become sons of light and know all things. Otherwise, how could John's epistle be entitled "The REVELATION of Jesus Christ"? How do you "reveal" something that is buried in confusion and mystery?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Aquila, Peter is talking about scripture being misinterpreted.

Period.

Are we proposing that one must have 100% accuracy in their interpretation/understanding of Scripture or their soul will be lost???

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Can the "beast" be the Roman Catholic Church and the Whore Babylon be America?

No, because the woman riding the Beast is my ex-wife. LOL