"Beards are sin!" False doctrine?

[Truthseeker]

Isn't clean shaved a modern CULTural thing?

[Amanah]

Bible Beard is an Apostolic

Standard Apostolic Orthodoxy with a Twist
August 4, 2017
Bible Beard

We believe the Gospel: The death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

We believe that in obeying the Gospel you must follow Peter’s command in Acts 2:38

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost [When you receive the Holy Ghost you will speak in tongues]

We believe there is One God and His name is Jesus.

We believe you must continue in the Apostles doctrine and live a holy life unto the Lord.

The TWIST is we enforce this Truth!

https://www.biblebeard.org/single-po...y-with-a-Twist

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The only poor men are those who don't have the guts to make holy hamburger out of sacred cows and kick aside the doctrines of men. When it comes to being Apostolic... if an Apostolic man has a beard... you know he ain't no sniveling man pleaser who licks his pastor's boots every time he gives an arbitrary and unbiblical edict. You can also bet if he's older, he's been mocked, berated, condemned, shown the seat, and chided about needing to shave half the time he's graced the doors of a church.

We need to get back to the Bible.

You haven't answered a question I've asked:

Where do you draw the line, using your view of James' writings? He's speaking of two unsaved men. You claim it shows that there shouldn't be any discrimination. You say it's wrong to have guidelines and expectations for those who wish to be used in ministry and on the platform.

So where do you draw the line?

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by n david

Okay, I'll play your game. I won't call them drunkards or whores. James' writing only says a rich man and poor man came into the assembly. He didn't say they were brothers or fellow christians, just a rich man and a poor man. From the writing, it would not be wrong to assume these were secular and unsaved men.

So the issue remains. To use James' words and say there should be no discrimination, no guidelines for those used in ministry -- where do you draw the line?

No brother. It is not "just a rich man and a poor man". In fact the KJV never mentions rich or poor. It only mentions what they are wearing. Why do you want to focus on the fact that it is not mentioned (whether are not they are brothers), yet you ignore what IS mentioned. The fact that is mentioned is that the clothes they are wearing, influences where they are allowed to sit. You are ASSUMING the size of their bank accounts, and you may be right or you may be wrong. Everyone who wears plain clothing is not a pauper, as everyone who wears "gay" clothing is not necessarily rich.

What James is saying is amazing in how relevant it is to this day. Where you sit is tied to your clothing. Whether it is "appropriate" for the platform. Your own testimony reveals the relevance of the scripture after nearly two thousand years.

I LOOK FORWARD TO THE DAY WHEN WE ARE JUDGED BY THE CONTENT OF OUR MESSAGE RATHER THAN THE COST OF OUR CLOTHES.

Do you have a "standard" that says that a preacher must wear a suit to preach, whether spoken or unspoken?

Do you have to wear a suit to be in the pulpit?

I believe these are the things James was addressing.

These are the things that you believe I am taking out of context.

Whichever one of us is right, the fact is that James identifies it as sin and it is clear that it is the ones with the say over who sits where are doing the sinning.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

In fact the KJV never mentions rich or poor.

What KJV are you reading?

For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment

And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool

But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?

Do you believe James is talking about ordinary Joe Friday when he writes about a gold ring, good apparel and gay clothing, then later talks about RICH men?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

You haven't answered a question I've asked:

Where do you draw the line, using your view of James' writings? He's speaking of two unsaved men.

Let's look at what James wrote:

James 2:1-9 (ESV)
1 My brothers, show no partiality as you hold the faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. 2 For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, 3 and if you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “You sit here in a good place,” while you say to the poor man, “You stand over there,” or, “Sit down at my feet,” 4 have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? 5 Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him? 6 But you have dishonored the poor man. Are not the rich the ones who oppress you, and the ones who drag you into court? 7 Are they not the ones who blaspheme the honorable name by which you were called?
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well. 9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.

Where does it say that these two men are "unsaved"? In fact James accuses those who show such preference as having made unjustified distinctions "among themselves", indicating that this is a fellowship meeting, and a wealthy brother is being given favoritism, while the poor brother is being denied such partiality. While the example is comparing the favoritism of rich over poor... the lesson is don't show partiality in relation to attire, appearance, race, status, etc. He sums up the point in verses 8 through 9.

If you think this only applies to rich and poor... then I guess that in your mind it wouldn't apply to white vs. black? Or any other form of partiality???

It's the principle being taught. Don't show partiality based on externals. Love your neighbor as yourself.

You claim it shows that there shouldn't be any discrimination. You say it's wrong to have guidelines and expectations for those who wish to be used in ministry and on the platform.

No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that discrimination, guidelines, and expectations should be based on principles as found in the Scriptures. Not the arbitrary whims of a pastor, board, or denomination. The Scriptures are complete and adequate to address every issue that we might encounter in this life.

So where do you draw the line?

Where do I draw the line???

Where the Bible specifically draws the line, or where biblical principles found in Scriptures draw the line.

Where do you draw the line???

[n david]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

I LOOK FORWARD TO THE DAY WHEN WE ARE JUDGED BY THE CONTENT OF OUR MESSAGE RATHER THAN THE COST OF OUR CLOTHES.

HA!

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by n david

What KJV are you reading?

For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment

And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool

But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?

Do you believe James is talking about ordinary Joe Friday when he writes about a gold ring, good apparel and gay clothing, then later talks about RICH men?

Pardon me. I stand corrected.

Now that I know that you can read, could you show me in your KJV where they (the rich and the poor man in the example) were not saved?

Even if you can't, I won't say that you are dumb.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Let's look at what James wrote:

James 2:1-9 (ESV)
1 My brothers, show no partiality as you hold the faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. 2 For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, 3 and if you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “You sit here in a good place,” while you say to the poor man, “You stand over there,” or, “Sit down at my feet,” 4 have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? 5 Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him? 6 But you have dishonored the poor man. Are not the rich the ones who oppress you, and the ones who drag you into court? 7 Are they not the ones who blaspheme the honorable name by which you were called? 8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well. 9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.

Where does it say that these two men are "unsaved"?

Verse 2 is a good indicator. "For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in,"

Let me know when you see it.

Originally Posted by Aquila

In fact James accuses those who show such preference as having made unjustified distinctions "among themselves", indicating that this is a fellowship meeting, and a wealthy brother is being given favoritism, while the poor brother is being denied such partiality.

"Among themselves" is not referring to the rich man. The rich man is not a brother, nor is the poor man a brother.

Originally Posted by Aquila

No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that discrimination, guidelines, and expectations should be based on principles as found in the Scriptures. Not the arbitrary whims of a pastor, board, or denomination.

Of course that's not what you're saying. You're just complaining about beards and want something in scripture to point to so you can make your point that you're mad as you-know-where and you're not going to take it anymore.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Where the Bible specifically draws the line, or where biblical principles found in Scripture draw the line.

But you believe James said you're not to discriminate against anyone. (Not really, but we're pretending to make you feel better about the beard)

You like "what ifs" and fantasy stuff:

So here comes a Trinitarian minister into your church. He's not immoral. He prays five times a day, fasts three days a week and talks in tongues like a chinese laundromat. He wants to attend and preach.

Or what if Simple Sally comes in. She's by secular accounts a good and moral lady. She's never been saved, but wants to sing in the choir.

Let's imagine more...

Sam comes in. He's laid back. Doesn't wish to "conform" to "institutional" church dress. He's saved, sanctified and filled with the HG. But he doesn't want to spend money on dress clothes. He believes you should be able to "come as you are." After all, there's no Bible chapter and verse telling him he's required to wear dress slacks or shirt, much less a suit and tie to be a minister and preach. So he typically wears jeans or shorts and a graphic t-shirt to church. Poor Sam. He's got anointing, too. He loves to testify, because it's the only time they let him speak. He knows the scripture and always blesses the congregation. But alas, he sits on the pew in his t-shirt and shorts. One day, he thinks, I have a dream one day I'll be able to wear my shorts and t-shirt on the platform to preach a message.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

Now that I know that you can read, could you show me in your KJV where they (the rich and the poor man in the example) were not saved?

"For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in,"