UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

[hometown guy]

Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness

I dont get it. Some would leave a church and go find the one that.fits their fantsy so they can have a beard. No matter the relationship between the church and the family or the pastor. No loyalty, no pastoral authority, no submission.

Bottom line is they don’t want a pastor. They want the benefits of a Christian and still have there carnal life style

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

Bottom line is they don’t want a pastor. They want the benefits of a Christian and still have there carnal life style

It's not that they don't want a pastor, because we first need to define "they?"
No one issue is the same, and pretty much their reasons vary. Don't get me wrong there are troublemakers, and lone wolves looking to prey on the young, weak, and sick. But others have different issues. Therefore it takes time for someone to work with them as long as they are willing to do some work themselves.

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

Bottom line is they don’t want a pastor. They want the benefits of a Christian and still have there carnal life style

That is why people need to be taught that unless they are being led of the Spirit of God and producing the fruit of the Spirit they will not enter heaven. (to be carnally minded is death Romans 8)

Also if they profane the temple of God they will be lost. (1 Cor 3)

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Should an evangelist inquire as to the general condition of the (local) church, or any pressing problems that might need to be addressed, upon accepting an invitation to come preach?

Nope, as for me, it just makes me lose my focus. Better not knowing a thing, when you tag it down to the last detail. That way everyone knows it was Jesus coming around taking names. Especially the pastor. Time spent in the pastor’s office is better spent on our knees in the prayer room.

[Apostolic1ness]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Nope, as for me, it just makes me lose my focus. Better not knowing a thing, when you tag it down to the last detail. That way everyone knows it was Jesus coming around taking names. Especially the pastor. Time spent in the pastor’s office is better spent on our knees in the prayer room.

AMEN!

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Exactly right, and I don't give any pastor my personal opinion if NOT asked first. He is building the work, or it is thriving and growing. You walk into a church and people are strangers to you. Visiting ministers tend to pull on the white glove and give the place a good once over. Then over at Cracker Barrel you get some free unsolicited advise about Sister Gilly Ginamae, and Uncle Fetus LeRoy, about how they both watch GOT, but both are looking as Apostolic as a 1970 Apostolic record album cover??? Or a Sister who is still wearing pants after they found out she has been in the church for over 15 years??? Hey I done it when I was a wee lamb, yet, I got egg on my face later on, when I considered the greater scope. Pastor Foofoofnick must be not hammering down the nails that are sticking out!!! He got to take charge and tell these people how the cow ate the cabbage!!! No, he must listen to God, and allow the Lord to lead him in his church family. Unhindered by anyone's unsolicited advise.

Yessir yessir!!!!

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

A teacher is to teach Thus Saith The Lord, book, chapter, and verse. Just because the teacher suddenly gets "new light" on something doesn't mean anything, rather instead everything has to be presented book chapter verse. And the congregation accepts book chapter and verse regardless of their personal preferences, history, whatever, cause a congregation of Christians is a congregation of dead folks who's personal wants and wishes have been buried and replaced with God's Will.

If not, if book chapter and verse butts heads with personal wants wishes and issues, and book chapter and verse don't prevail? That person or congregation has much bigger issues and needs to get saved all over again. Because either Jesus, the Incarnate Word, is Lord of ALL, or not at all.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by hometown guy

Sounds pretty interesting that first coming to church you had so much knowledge that what was being taught had no scriptural foundation.

It could be that whomever presented it didn't open the bible, but rather told stories of yesteryear. It would be easy to interpret "no bible reference" as "no scriptural foundation." I have heard many a sermon during which the minister read a single verse, yet preached for an hour. He might have been right, but it wasn't because of his single, unrelated scripture reference.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

The pastor has 365 days to straighten out a bent road.

Absolutely. Which is all the more reason the pastor should have the leeway to do what he feels God is leading him to do.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Huge responsibility. But only those who are going in the same direction of the elders. Not busy bodies, or troublemakers looking to bring on a munity.

Agreed. Simply saying 'saints' was likely too broad a usage.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

But still no body wants anyone to have a gang mentality. The ministry is working on and with everyone in the church family. Brother and Sister Goober might want to come down on MeeMaw because she has gone to see the Avengers marathon. But they need to move with the Holy Ghost, not the Holy Toast. Going to a diner and having a group tell you that they don't like Brother Tom Bombadil, because he is still dipping. Well, he doesn't dip when he is at church, no spitting around the property? Well, one brother pipes up and tells that Old Brother Tom does it at work. So what! The guy is obviously TRYING. So, pray for the brother, because he really needs the prayer, and you all sure need the practice.

Thank you! We definitely need to make distinctions between those who refuse to get right and those who are struggling in their efforts.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

I think I cover this above, but real sin? No, they just have issues on the things they see on the surface.

Boy, ain't that the truth!?!

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

The brothers and sisters who really know their pastor, and his desire for them, don't sweat the small stuff. They abide, and they grow taller with Jesus and the elders.

Amen.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness

You say outdated, but to whom is it outdated? Surely not to the pastors and saints that came out of the 60s that identified their own beards with rebellion. How is that outdated? So here comes beards, skinny jeans, cap sleeves, mini skirts, diamond rings etc.where do you draw the line? Some of those things are not found in scriptures.

Originally Posted by hometown guy

Marlboro reds, tank tops, Mohawks ect...

Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness

I dont get it. Some would leave a church and go find the one that.fits their fantsy so they can have a beard. No matter the relationship between the church and the family or the pastor. No loyalty, no pastoral authority, no submission.

Originally Posted by hometown guy

Bottom line is they don’t want a pastor. They want the benefits of a Christian and still have there carnal life style

All of that is fine and dandy, but this started with "a conservative pastor with a not-so-conservative congregation" being too cowardly to stand for the truth. He was a dumb dog that couldn't bark. Now why would those of us in the more moderate places listen to you folks when you hold us in such contempt? At best we seem to be compromisers.

So let me ask it as plainly as possible: should those of us in other areas be following our pastors even if they don't teach/enforce the same standards as yours? Are we your brothers or are we compromisers?

I may disagree with your pastor, but I have no reason to doubt he is doing what he thinks is best, and I would certainly consider both of you brothers.