Take heed unto thyself, and unto the DOCTRINE

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

How important is doctrine to you?

Paul stresses the importance of doctrine several times to Timothy in 1 Timothy Chapter 4. He seems to indicate that doctrine is very important for the minister to uphold to the flock. He tells Timothy to give attendance to DOCTRINE. He also tells Timothy to Take heed unto the DOCTRINE.

We live in a country that is fast leaving solid doctrine. Even in the Apostolic ranks the teacher of doctrine is fast being traded in for the progressive, motivational preacher, who says a whole lot of flowery words, but instills nothing lasting into the heart of the hearer.

So just how much do you value down to earth solid doctrine?

It's priceless. Personally I'd go to great lengths to hear, read or somehow share in the exposition of solid doctrine.

But then I'd look around and see that a few of my brethren are restless and uncomfortable. They've heard or read something into what was said and now they want to divide over semantics.

What constitutes "down to earth solid doctrine?"

[Felicity]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

I can take it back if you'd like. LOL

I agree with a lot you say. I guess maybe I should verbalize it more, so you don't think I am always contrary.

Nonononooooo. Don't take it back. I want to keep that post as proof that "Matt agreed with me once".

Hehehe!

Yes, you should verbalize agreement with me more often. It makes me feel warm and fuzzy and feel validated when you do.

J/K.

[RevDWW]

2 Timothy 4:2 - 5 (KJV) 2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. 5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.


It's not that folks don't want doctrine they just don't want sound doctrine. Easy believism doesn't take commitment or perseverance or temperance. There are all kinds of talented teachers but they are no closer to the kingdom than the ones they teach.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by keith4him

I got into a discussion with a scholar this week over the idea of what the first church did without the canon of scripture, they turned the word upside down with only oral sayings passed on, some had access to the OT but that was few in #.

The passing of letters among churches happened in the latter part of the founding of the churches.

What doctrine was passed, most likely Eph 4 that was sung as a hymn and Hebrews 6 was gives a consise summary of what they agreed on.

Remember doctrine=teaching, and that was passed on by word of mouth.

They had the Torah for their foundation concerning the doctrine of Messiah.

They also had the written testimony of many who had seen and heard Yeshua.

Luke said:

1: Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,
2: Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;
3: It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,
4: That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

They probably had more knowledge to go by than we do today.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

They had the Torah for their foundation concerning the doctrine of Messiah.

They also had the written testimony of many who had seen and heard Yeshua.

Luke said:

1: Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,
2: Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;
3: It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,
4: That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

They probably had more knowledge to go by than we do today.

Luke wrote that much later than the time period that Keith was referring to.

What were the sources of the knowledge that they did have? How could they discern between a true and a false report concerning something Jesus had done hundreds of miles away and a decade or so prior?

[Nahum]

I am reading a book from Rob Bell titled Velvet Elvis .

It has shaken me to my core.

So much that I don't even know if I should keep reading or not.

It's all about our elevation of doctrine over our love for God.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Luke wrote that much later than the time period that Keith was referring to.

What were the sources of the knowledge that they did have? How could they discern between a true and a false report concerning something Jesus had done hundreds of miles away and a decade or so prior?

Just believe what Luke said.

1: Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,
2: Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;
3: It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,
4: That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

Many ministers heard Yeshua teach. They wrote it down. They were closer to the action than us by far.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

I am reading a book from Rob Bell titled Velvet Elvis .

It has shaken me to my core.

So much that I don't even know if I should keep reading or not.

It's all about our elevation of doctrine over our love for God.

Dont be shaken. We cannot even love him properly unless we are TAUGHT how.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Just believe what Luke said.

1: Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,
2: Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;
3: It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,
4: That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

Many ministers heard Yeshua teach. They wrote it down. They were closer to the action than us by far.

uhm... but, we were talking about the time period before Luke wrote. What did the people at that time do? How did they discern doctrine?

And what constitutes "down to earth solid doctrine" from the 1st post in this thread?

[Felicity]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

I am reading a book from Rob Bell titled Velvet Elvis .

It has shaken me to my core.

So much that I don't even know if I should keep reading or not.

It's all about our elevation of doctrine over our love for God.

Keep reading. It's an interesting book but it won't hurt you.

I found what he wrote about "yokes" really interesting and discovered something that I'd never known before. And that is what a "yoke" is. It's "teaching" or "doctrine". Each rabbi had their own "yoke". Jesus - who was regarded as a Rabbi or Teacher said His yoke in comparison to the other rabbis (the Pharisees and others maybe? ) was easy.

Interesting, huh?