Where are all the Acts 2:38 folks (3-steppers)??

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Aquila
I truly loved the illustration a brother gave about conception.

A child is conceived in the womb and there is no apparent evidence that a new life has begun, yet the child is alive...it is a life. However, upon birth it breaks the water and is seen by all. Then it takes it's first breath.

Is it possible that the salvation of a soul begins at repentance and it is therefore spiritually conceived; yet evidence of this new life isn't witnessed until it matures and is water baptized? Then this soul takes it's first breath by receiving the Holy Ghost?

To deny that a soul doesn't experience salvation and new life in Christ at repentance would then be the same as arguing that a child isn't truly alive upon conception.

True repentance should bring the infilling of the Holy Ghost, Only God can see in mans heart the sincerity within. I can not figure out how some here are so anointed as to see a mans heart and recognize true repentance.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Sam

Joan Baez said that her mother once advised her, "If you ever have your choice between facing a real lion and a hypothetical lion, choose the real lion because it is much less dangerous."

Lesson learned, Sam.

I usually avoid the hypothetical. I won't make the same mistake next time Some folks don't appreciate an honest response.

[stmatthew]

You folks are making me laugh with all your hypothetical situations.

Where is our faith??

Is God so small that he cannot make a way for someone to be born again of water and of Spirit if they are truely seeking him??

and then there is the "signs following" ministry of healing. Have we now lost faith in Gods ability to heal those that come to him in faith?? Can one have faith for salvation, and be able to have faith for healing?? The same God that saves (sozo) is the same God that heals (sozo) and makes whole (sozo).

[Ferd]

You know, at the end of the day, none of us are responsible for the "exceptions" God is.

Nor are we called to create a plan based on some list of exceptions.

God has given us his Word for us to follow. Jesus told Peter to tell the rest of us (Please note, Peter not Paul).

Peter preached the Gospel, then when asked by those whose hearts were pricked, he told them to repent, be baptized, and recieve the gift of the HG.

What God does with someone on their death bed is His perogative. I am not responsible, nor do I feel compelled to change the message to fit the circumstance.

I simply follow a simple truth and let God be God.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

You folks are making me laugh with all your hypothetical situations.

Where is our faith??

Is God so small that he cannot make a way for someone to be born again of water and of Spirit if they are truely seeking him??

and then there is the "signs following" ministry of healing. Have we now lost faith in Gods ability to heal those that come to him in faith?? Can one have faith for salvation, and be able to have faith for healing?? The same God that saves (sozo) is the same God that heals (sozo) and makes whole (sozo).

PREACH!!!!!!!!

[Apprehended]

Interesting. Interesting indeed.

I looooove Brother Matthew. He knows it too.

But, I am not quite sure of the "automation" theory.

I wouldn't throw the gaunlet down on my faith. I have seen faith hurt by taking the position "if God don't heal, he does not save either. If he has saved me, he will also heal me. It also then follows if he does not heal, he does not save either." God does not automatically do both at the same time. I've seen many people go through the NB experience without ever having realized healing in their body but the salvation must not be doubted in the absence of the other.

We can stand on His promises, however. He was wounded for our transgression (that's sin) He was bruised for our iniquities (that's our lawlessness) the chastisement of our peace (that's freedom from our sorrows and pain) was upon Him and by His stripes we are healed.

The word "are" indicates a present standing condition which applies to all of the above, including sin, lawlessness, pain and sorrows, sicknesses and diseases which He has ALREADY moved away by the work of the Cross. Faith appropriates the WHOLE work of God which is already accomplished.

You are already healed...appropriate it by faith

You are already forgiven your transgression...appropriate it by faith

You are already free from pain and sorrow...appropriate it by faith.

You are already forgiven your lawlessness...appropriate it by faith.

Appropriation of all at once is not automatic, neither is one dependent upon another. It is the blood of Jesus that provided all of the presently provided provision of Isa 53:5. It is the faith of the believer that appropriates for himself all that is already provided. Whatever is appropriated by faith through the blood of Jesus, the believing one is "sozo" which is to say "saved" whether it be one of the above or all of the above, together at once or one at a time.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

I don't live in India.

We don't use chain hoists in the hospital. Give me a break! What whirlpool cannot immerse a person. Are you thinking we do whirlpools in a trough?

Since you are going to nitpic and keep narrowing the scope of the question so that it would, in your mind, be impossible to baptize this hypothetical dying person and then if I say without water baptism they are not born again, you will of course accuse me of whatever floats your boat, I'm bowing out of this foolishness.

God is able to heal a dying repentant person so they can be baptized.

Could you, or would your hospital allow a person to be baptized who had a femoral catheter and an IV/Buffalo cap? What about someone with surgical wounds and stitches that cannot be immersed? What about other types of catheters or a fresh colostomy?

In most cases a cast could be covered and wrapped watertight, however in a hospital movement from a "traction" like set up is not possible for some time.

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Could you, or would your hospital allow a person to be baptized who had a femoral catheter and an IV/Buffalo cap? What about someone with surgical wounds and stitches that cannot be immersed?

In most cases a cast could be covered and wrapped watertight, however in a hospital movement from a "traction" like set up is not possible for some time.

I believe this falls under that special category called "God is not stupid."

[scotty]

Again I say "sprinkle" is acceptable through faith and prayer...if we are gonna split hairs. Hypothetically..

[Nahum]

My only obligation is to preach God's Word. When people ask me how they should prepare for heaven I'm gonna point them to a genuine understanding of Peter's commandments at Pentecost. What happens to them after that is between them and God.