Major Split in the MS District UPC?

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Raven

The most common scripture of all to be half quoted. Hebrews 12:14 "Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord."
The sentence structure is obvious in that peace is the primary subject and holiness the secondary. Therefore my question to you scholars: If you don't follow peace with all men will you see the Lord?
Respectfully
Raven

It takes peace as well as holiness. As a matter of a fact, I read the verse to mean that peace is pursued first, and then holiness. Maybe that is because if we can have a peacable relationship with our brother then our sense of holiness remains right. It is amazing how many contend over holiness to the point of losing true peace.

[The Dean]

Originally Posted by rrford

It takes peace as well as holiness. As a matter of a fact, I read the verse to mean that peace is pursued first, and then holiness. Maybe that is because if we can have a peacable relationship with our brother then our sense of holiness remains right. It is amazing how many contend over holiness to the point of losing true peace.

Truth

[Rev]

Originally Posted by anapko

Excellant point Raven! Many want to only look at the second half thinking they have it all yet alienate themselves from true evangelism by not walking in peace with all men. Good Post!

Peace with all men?

Words of John the Baptist.....

(Mat 3:7) But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?



Words of Jesus....

(Mat 23:32) Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
(Mat 23:33) Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

[Just a Shepherd]

The problem with most "holiness" teaching in the UPC is that it is confused with "standards." One cannot be made holy by their clothing choices. Biblical holiness and organizational dress codes are not the same thing.

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd

The problem with most "holiness" teaching in the UPC is that it is confused with "standards." One cannot be made holy by their clothing choices. Biblical holiness and organizational dress codes are not the same thing.

But if those codes and standards are based upon Biblical principles of holiness then those things become critical.

Originally Posted by rrford

But if those codes and standards are based upon Biblical principles of holiness then those things become critical.

Have I said that I was glad you were back?

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Steadfast

Have I said that I was glad you were back?

LOL! This is a test. This is only a test.


Like I said on another thread earlier..."Life is like a vapor..."

[Rev]

Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd

The problem with most "holiness" teaching in the UPC is that it is confused with "standards." One cannot be made holy by their clothing choices. Biblical holiness and organizational dress codes are not the same thing.

(1Ti 2:9) In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

If it's showing off to much of the body I don't think you could call it holy. What is modest? Someone has to set the standard! Does the dress need to come to the knee, below the knee, or six inches above the knee? You have to set a modest standard for the lawless in the church and every church has them!

[Just a Shepherd]

Originally Posted by rrford

But if those codes and standards are based upon Biblical principles of holiness then those things become critical.

The problem is that the leadership of the UPC has taught the people over the years to put their faith in standards by making them more important than producing godly fruit meet for repentance. What is critical is a passionate prayer life and hunger and thirst for spiritual things. Without those things you might as well go around naked... Revelation 3:14,15

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Just a Shepherd

The problem is that the leadership of the UPC has taught the people over the years to put their faith in standards by making them more important than producing godly fruit meet for repentance. What is critical is a passionate prayer life and hunger and thirst for spiritual things. Without those things you might as well go around naked... Revelation 3:14,15

I cannot actually agree with such a borad brush approach. I will agree that some have done so and have done damage to the true spirit of holiness. So much so that too many folks have wnet to the other extreme.