Breaking into church cliques

[Rhoni]

Through the years many churches have been known for their attitude of "us four and no more", and breaking into cliques of family or friends who have always done things the same way, with the same people for as long as anyone remembers. Just where is it that the new member/new convert fits?

Having been on both sides of the fence, Pastor's wife & saint, I have seen the clique issue from both sides. Pastor's & their wives hate to cause waves, especially new Pastor's & wives...so what are they to do to break the cliques, and allow others into leadership roles.

I only know the wrong way...we took a well-established church and within two years had revamped it and they pretty much kicked us out...even though what we did worked. No one really cares if it works or not...they just want to do things the way they have always done them.

So, this is an opportunity for some of you to educate me: how would you suggest making changes in leadership that would benefit the church without alienating the "pillars of the church"?

Just curious,
Rhoni

[RandyWayne]

So, this is an opportunity for some of you to educate me: how would you suggest making changes in leadership that would benefit the church without alienating the "pillars of the church"?

I can think of one, and only one, method. Constantly cave to the complaining of "the pillars" and consistently lift them up as true saints. Make them feel important. Compliment them at every turn. Elevate them!

I wish I was joking, but if we are talking about a small number of people (or large number in some cases), if the choice is souls or keeping some "pillars" happy, I'll take the souls.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

I can think of one, and only one, method. Constantly cave to the complaining of "the pillars" and consistently lift them up as true saints. Make them feel important. Compliment them at every turn. Elevate them!

I wish I was joking, but if we are talking about a small number of people (or large number in some cases), if the choice is souls or keeping some "pillars" happy, I'll take the souls.

Bro Randy,

That is a nice, idealistic thought, but not quite the reality.

Blessings, Rhoni

P.S. What about taring up the good wheat while trying to pull out the weeds?

[dizzyde]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Through the years many churches have been known for their attitude of "us four and no more", and breaking into cliques of family or friends who have always done things the same way, with the same people for as long as anyone remembers. Just where is it that the new member/new convert fits?

Having been on both sides of the fence, Pastor's wife & saint, I have seen the clique issue from both sides. Pastor's & their wives hate to cause waves, especially new Pastor's & wives...so what are tehy to do to break the ckiques and allow others into leadership roles.

I only know the wrong way...we took a well-established church and within two years had revamped it and they pretty much kicked us out...even though what we did worked. No one really cares if it works or not...they just want to do things the way they have always done them.

So, this is an opportunity for some of you to educate me: how would you suggest making changes in leadership that would benefit the church without alienating the "pillars of the church"?

Just curious,
Rhoni

S-L-O-W-L-Y. A little tic, but seriously, we have made a lot of changes at the church I attend over the last 4 or 5 years, and it has been a real struggle with some of them, but overall, there hasn't been a large revolt.

It helps if all of the leaders are on the same page, but the biggest keys in what I have seen, is do it fairly slowly, and don't change too much at once.

One example is the traditional song service. We started using 3 main music groups (Adult Choir, Youth Choir and Praise and Worship Team), and one of them leads the worship every service. So it was fairly easy to eliminate the song books this way, it caused minimal outrage because the whole format was different. But we also try work a "song book" song into the mix fairly regularly for the older saints.

It is really a tightrope, you test test the waters a little bit to see the reactions and figure out what will work with the individual congregation. Some of the changes our congregation just jumped in to, so you really never know!

[RandyWayne]

I would assume that using the phrase "without alienating the "pillars of the church"" indicated that you think they would be resistant to any change.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

I would assume that using the phrase "without alienating the "pillars of the church"" indicated that you think they would be resistant to any change.

Yes, you are right in that assumption. I'd give for isntances but I couldn't handle the remarks tonight so I'll let you guys talk and I'll listen for a change

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by dizzyde

S-L-O-W-L-Y. A little tic, but seriously, we have made a lot of changes at the church I attend over the last 4 or 5 years, and it has been a real struggle with some of them, but overall, there hasn't been a large revolt.

It helps if all of the leaders are on the same page, but the biggest keys in what I have seen, is do it fairly slowly, and don't change too much at once.

One example is the traditional song service. We started using 3 main music groups (Adult Choir, Youth Choir and Praise and Worship Team), and one of them leads the worship every service. So it was fairly easy to eliminate the song books this way, it caused minimal outrage because the whole format was different. But we also try work a "song book" song into the mix fairly regularly for the older saints.

It is really a tightrope, you test test the waters a little bit to see the reactions and figure out what will work with the individual congregation. Some of the changes our congregation just jumped in to, so you really never know!

Yes, I understand the concept of slowly... but waiting until they all die off is a bit disparaging.

[Blubayou]

I will add my two cents- it is worth just about that,too-I have been part of leadership- not at a church, but I think the principles carry over, and I have been on the receiving end of leadership change in a church. I think with leadership change- you have to prove first that you care for the group of people you are leading, gain their trust and appreciation and then begin to change things but slowly. First, you must have a plan or vision for where you want the organization to go. Next, you must communicate that vision or plan to the people, i.e. saints. Then you must communicate it again and again. The change cannot be just because you think it is best for the church. Remember, it is the saints church, too. They have worked long and hard for that church and have a vested interest. I think that people will accept change if you have done a good job laying a foundation as to why you are bring about the change. If they understand why, there is a need for change, then they will accept it. This is a slow building process that will take place over several years. JMHO

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Blubayou

I will add my two cents- it is worth just about that,too-I have been part of leadership- not at a church, but I think the principles carry over, and I have been on the receiving end of leadership change in a church. I think with leadership change- you have to prove first that you care for the group of people you are leading, gain their trust and appreciation and then begin to change things but slowly. First, you must have a plan or vision for where you want the organization to go. Next, you must communicate that vision or plan to the people, i.e. saints. Then you must communicate it again and again. The change cannot be just because you think it is best for the church. Remember, it is the saints church, too. They have worked long and hard for that church and have a vested interest. I think that people will accept change if you have done a good job laying a foundation as to why you are bring about the change. If they understand why, there is a need for change, then they will accept it. This is a slow building process that will take place over several years. JMHO

This is true...wisdom speaks!

Thank you,
rhoni

[Rhoni]

Being in a clique, how would one go about bringing others into it instead of leaving them out? Or should you?