What Happened At Pentecost in Acts 2?

[houston]

Originally Posted by mfblume

You mean to say you think only preterists believe a resurrection occurred on the day of Pentecost?


Romans 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

You got preterism mixed up a bit, since full preterists think resurrection occurred in AD70 (not partial preterists, btw), but EVERYONE SHOULD believe resurrection on the day of Pentecost! Saying a resurrection occurred on the day of Pentecost is not what distinguishes preterism from anything.

I'm not exactly a preterist/fulfilled eschatologist... and I believe this. But, I do not know any "futurist" who believes this. It is probably on their slippery slope. Believe that... then you will be a preterist in no time!

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by houston

I'm not exactly a preterist/fulfilled eschatologist... and I believe this. But, I do not know any "futurist" who believes this. It is probably on their slippery slope. Believe that... then you will be a preterist in no time!

lol

I know many futurists who believe this, since it is not a futurist/preterist issue, really.

Author Watchman Nee taught on it extensively, and he was a die-hard dispensationalist. Andrew Murray taught it as well as FB Meyer and Gene Edwards, etc., though I would not say Gene Edwards is a futurist.

It is a VITAL truth that flatly is not preached much anywhere. I got turned onto it before I ever became a preterist, and to this day preach it more than anything else. To me, it's the preaching of the cross.

[TGBTG]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Romans 6, as the former poster showed, teaches we were baptized into the death of Jesus thereby making His death become OUR DEATHS. That means our union to Christ allows us to say WE DIED WITH HIM. This in turn means we were BURIED WITH HIM. And then it follows that we were RESURRECTED WITH HIM, and this all occurred spiritually, which has nothing to do with the fact that there is a second resurrection that shall occur later, as 1 Cor 15 put a resurrection in Paul's future long after Paul was already spiritually resurrected through salvation.

The resurrection mentioned in Romans 6 is not the resurrection of 1 Cor 15. In Romans 6, Paul said Christ died ONCE to sin and is now alive (resurrected) unto God forevermore. Then he proceeded to say that we must likewise reckon ourselves DEAD INDEED unto sin and ALIVE (resurrected) unto God THROUGH JESUS. In other words, because Jesus experienced these things, and we came into union with Him by salvation, then we are to realize we experienced these things spiritually as well. And Paul continued to teach that this is the basis for us to come into a lifestyle that has victory in everyday life situations. But we have to consciously understand these facts as being true for us and stand on them in order to have the confidence we can really have victory in every day life.

Romans 6:6-11 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. (7) For he that is dead is freed from sin. (8) Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. (10) For
in that he died, he died unto sin once:
but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
(11) Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin,
but alive unto God
through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Then Paul finally tells us to present ourselves to God KNOWING we are alive from the dead (resurrected) in Romans 6:13, in order for God to be able to empower us with His Spiritual strength, since it requires our faith in that experience of being spiritually resurrected in order for God to be able to bless us and enjoy such a risen life.

Colossians 2 mirrors that teaching and says we are buried with Him in baptism and risen with Him as well (resurrected) through faith in the operation of God.

Again, that is not a preterist thing. It is intended to be understood by every believer. But it just ain't preached much any more!

Since people were SAVED at Pentecost, that means they died, were buried and resurrected with Jesus. Salvation is death, burial and resurrecton with Jesus. This is supposed to be elementary, as the former poster showed.

TGBGT, your question shows the same issue Paul had to deal with in the Romans. They were saved but never knew these facts about their salvation. Too many do not know these thoughts.

Romans 6:3 Know ye not...?

Romans 6:6 Knowing this...

Romans 6:9 Knowing...

Romans 6:16 Know ye not...?

So many never heard it preached that we died WITH Jesus so that we could say we were RESURRECTED WITH HIM. This needs to be preached more!

But this has nothing to do with Jesus resurrecting on pentecost which occured in Acts 2? The OP says what happened in Acts2? (And someone says resurrection) I'm pretty sure Jesus resurrected before the day of pentecost in Acts 2...

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by TGBTG

But this has nothing to do with Jesus resurrecting on pentecost which occured in Acts 2? The OP says what happened in Acts2? (And someone says resurrection) I'm pretty sure Jesus resurrected before the day of pentecost in Acts 2...

The 3,000 saved were resurrected when they were saved. Jesus resurrected the third day after His death. But those saved on the day of Pentecost resurrected with him. When we got saved, bro., we were resurrected with Jesus spiritually.

Romans 6:11 occurred for everyone who got saved in Acts 2.

[mfblume]

When people resurrected with Jesus in Acts 2, that is to say they united to His death, burial and resurrection that He experienced weeks before. Any time anyone gets saved, you could say that person, then and there, died, was buried, and resurrected with Jesus. That is why OP said resurrection occurred on the day of Pentecost. It's just that God sees it that way when we get saved, and we are intended to begin to see it that way as well. The reason this is so vital is that we will not live in victory without this concept.

That is why Paul associated the fact that sin is not supposed to rule over us when he taught about our resurrection with Christ. Once you realize you are DEAD TO SIN, as much as Jesus DIED TO SIN ONCE, then you are meant to realize that you are therefore RESURRECTED WITH JESUS so that sin has no more power over you. The point is that we have power over sin after we are saved that we do not realize. Paul "walks us through" the concept in order to give us confidence that we do not have to be kicked around by sin like so many are being kicked around.

It's sad this is rarely taught.

When someone tells a person that they do not have to sin every now and then, they instinctively become VERY DOUBTFUL of that. Why? They look at their weak human power to resist sin. For that reason, they need to know THEY AROSE WITH JESUS. When they realize they died, were buried, and resurrected with Jesus, and also realize Jesus arose so that sin has no more power over Him, they can start to associate HIS POWER OVER SIN with THEIR LIVES, because everything He experienced in his death, burial and resurrection IS SHARED WITH US when we get saved.

This means that we SHARE HIS POWER OVER SIN. That is the reason Eph 2:6 says we were seated with Him on his throne, as well! WE SHARE HIS POWER.

So they are not "on their own" with their own power to face sin. THEY SHARE CHRIST'S POWER OVER SIN! This removes the doubt that they can overcome sin, and gives them confidence to overcome sin in their daily lives.

Notice that Romans 6:10 says Christ died to sin and is alive in resurrection life unto God.

Then we read "LIKEWISE" in verse 11. That means we must associate our states of being with what happened to Jesus. So, Paul said LIKEWISE -- in the same manner -- look at yourself as being dead to sin as much as Jesus was ("INDEED"), and resurrected unto God!

And as much as Jesus died to sin so that death and sin have no more power over him, Rom 6:12 says we should therefore not let sin rule in our lives!

[houston]

Originally Posted by TGBTG

Agreed.
But how does this imply Jesus resurrected on pentecost day in Acts 2?

My mind was on the track that believers were resurrected. Apparently Blume was on that track as well.

[houston]

Originally Posted by TGBTG

But this has nothing to do with Jesus resurrecting on pentecost which occured in Acts 2? The OP says what happened in Acts2? (And someone says resurrection) I'm pretty sure Jesus resurrected before the day of pentecost in Acts 2...

Opening line of the thread is:

OK, stop and think about what happened on the Day of Pentecost as recorded in Acts chapter 2.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by houston

My mind was on the track that believers were resurrected. Apparently Blume was on that track as well.

Right! SALVATION, which occurred on the day of Pentecost for 3,000 people, is actually RESURRECTION WITH JESUS. It did not occur the day Jesus resurrected, but it is speaking spiritually. When we are saved, it is because WE UNITED TO HIS DEATH, BURIAL AND RESURRECTION. So, since people got saved on the day of Pentecost, they resurrected on that day. Salvation is death, burial and resurrection with Jesus.

What happened historically with Jesus in His death, burial and resurrection, HAPPENS TO US THE MOMENT WE GET SAVED.

[TGBTG]

Originally Posted by mfblume

The 3,000 saved were resurrected when they were saved. Jesus resurrected the third day after His death. But those saved on the day of Pentecost resurrected with him. When we got saved, bro., we were resurrected with Jesus spiritually.

Romans 6:11 occurred for everyone who got saved in Acts 2.

Originally Posted by mfblume

When people resurrected with Jesus in Acts 2, that is to say they united to His death, burial and resurrection that He experienced weeks before. Any time anyone gets saved, you could say that person, then and there, died, was buried, and resurrected with Jesus. That is why OP said resurrection occurred on the day of Pentecost.

Originally Posted by houston

My mind was on the track that believers were resurrected. Apparently Blume was on that track as well.

I agree with the resurrection of believers with Christ which you guys have said. I guess I was just confused as to how what you guys were saying relates to the OP. I thought OP was referring to speaking in tongues and such like...oh well (it's sometimes hard to communicate effectively on forums...lol)

[mfblume]

TGBGT,

Did you ever look at your baptism as BAPTISM INTO CHRIST'S DEATH (Rom 6:3)? What did that mean to you?