Sarcasm noted.
I Corinthians 14:23
So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and inquirers or unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind?
I Corinthians 14:33
For God is not a God of disorder but of peace—as in all the congregations of the Lord’s people.
It seems to me he is greatly concerned about the confusion that was generated in the Corinthian church. The theme was personal edification should be kept in private. Public edification requires more discipline and order if everyone is to benefit---believer and unbeliever alike.
I wonder if people who convulse, scream, run around, flailing their arms---do that do that in the privacy of their prayer closet when it's just Jesus and them? Or does that only occur when there are onlookers? I think private worship and devotion should be more passionate and demonstrative than public worship. A husband and wife experience far greater passion and intimacy in private than they do in public. Unless of course they want to gross everybody out or go to jail. There's something uncomfortable about public displays of affection that cross a line. Why would it be any different with God?
I have witnessed a lot of very beautiful, genuine, sincere worship and I've witnessed a lot of showing off and self promoting, egotistical, hyped up carnal displays of affection that are more about the worshiper than the object of worship. Sadly, I must admit, being a part of the subculture, I caved into the power of suggestion and the atmosphere that unless you were going hog wild you weren't really worshiping.
Once at Bible school I got caught up in the peer pressure to lose all control and so I participated---on the heels of a week of Mangun family preaching and teaching---AM, Vesta, and GA. When I finished, I walked away feeling convicted that what I had done wasn't glorifying God but just me wanting acceptance. God convicted me and said, "while all this is going on, who is telling the lost about me?" I found a secret corner in the building and spent the rest of the time interceding for my lost friends.
Pentecostal culture doesn't really advocate "decent and order" worship---the wilder, crazier, out of control it is---the more godly it is. In my opinion and experience.
So you too have a definition of order. It's okay for you to define biblical order in church but you disparage me for having an opinion on order.
I just want to be biblical. I find no biblical evidence for many of the things that occur in Pentecostal/Spirit-Filled/Charismatic church services. Again, Google "holy laughter" or watch some other videos of non-apostolic Pentecostals and you will see some crazy stuff. There's one video of a guy diving in headfirst fully clothed into a baptistry.
Actually it was Paul preaching when the young man fell out of the window. I agree with you with the idea that we worship in our flesh. This idea of "in the spirit" means we lose all self-control, become some kind of a puppet on a string for God to sling us around is not biblical. I also agree that human beings have a b I also agree that human beings have a bent towards excess. That is why it's important to disciple and teach new believers what the Bible says about public worship. Growing up the only instructions we got were that liberty in the Holy Ghost meant no restrictions. Of course the Bible doesn't teach that.
I said that because you could go to a one God Jesus name apostolic Church in West Virginia, Kentucky, Georgia, or Alabama and witness people passing around venomous serpents and drinking poison out of mason jars and see that nothing happens to them and walk away concluding, if you're simply going to base it on what you saw with your own eyes and experiences, that their theology is sound.
The point I'm making is doctrine needs to be biblically-based, not rooted in experiences or anecdotal evidence.
I have indeed seen and heard plenty of unbelievers either express how the church service scared them, Or that the reputation of my church was strange or crazy.
I'm not saying that everything I witnessed or experienced was phony, A lot of genuine and sincere things happened. I believe in miracles I believe in the supernatural. But if something is not biblical I'm not going to accept it hook line and sinker.
I understand and agree in principle, but I don't think outsiders are going to say "those folks are crazy because they use pulpits and wireless microphones!
I'm all for diversity in the Body. That's why I choose not to be a Pentecostal as an identity. There will be plenty of Pentecostals in heaven. They just won't be he only ones.
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