The Flip Side of Spiritual Abuse

[Chateau d'If]

"Many ministers say they're tempted to throw in the towel or move because of people. Problem people to be exact. I remember the first church I served. After a few months I was approached by a man who felt called by God to be my accountability partner...without asking me. He offered to take me out to eat one day, so I accepted. Little was I prepared for what was about to happen.

Setting down his sandwich he said, "Brian, there are a number of things you are doing wrong, but for the sake of time I've kept my list to 10." I made the mistake of saying, "Start with number one." Two and a half hours later I left with two things--30% less self-esteem and a really good case for why first cousins should never marry.

Like most ministers, I've regularly felt the sting of difficult people. Looking back on some of these situations I've come to one conclusion: in every congregation there are always 3 or 4 blessed souls that are there because no other organization in town will put up with them.

Yes, I agree that it's hard to overestimate the damage some ministers have done to churches. I own that. I know I've caused my share of pain. But it's also healthy to acknowledge that many of God's servants walk with a limp because no-one in their congregation had the guts to stand up to a known troublemaker and protect their leader. It's at those times it becomes easy to question whether the price is too high, at least for me.

Written by Brian Jones

http://www.peopleoffaith.com/pastor-burnout.htm

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Chateau d'If

"Many ministers say they're tempted to throw in the towel or move because of people. Problem people to be exact. I remember the first church I served. After a few months I was approached by a man who felt called by God to be my accountability partner...without asking me. He offered to take me out to eat one day, so I accepted. Little was I prepared for what was about to happen.

Setting down his sandwich he said, "Brian, there are a number of things you are doing wrong, but for the sake of time I've kept my list to 10." I made the mistake of saying, "Start with number one." Two and a half hours later I left with two things--30% less self-esteem and a really good case for why first cousins should never marry.

Like most ministers, I've regularly felt the sting of difficult people. Looking back on some of these situations I've come to one conclusion: in every congregation there are always 3 or 4 blessed souls that are there because no other organization in town will put up with them.

Yes, I agree that it's hard to overestimate the damage some ministers have done to churches. I own that. I know I've caused my share of pain. But it's also healthy to acknowledge that many of God's servants walk with a limp because no-one in their congregation had the guts to stand up to a known troublemaker and protect their leader. It's at those times it becomes easy to question whether the price is too high, at least for me.

Written by Brian Jones

http://www.peopleoffaith.com/pastor-burnout.htm

Abuse is not selective, it does not discriminate!!

[MissBrattified]

A couple of things to discuss:

1. Whether or not abuse to an authority figure is quite the same dynamic as abusive behavior by an authority figure, and

2. The very real problem of "saints" who overrun, abuse, bully and harass those in ministry for various reasons.

On the first point, and barring physical abuse or blatant verbal abuse, I would say that it's difficult to interpret what actually comprises abusive behavior. Some people are simply annoying, but that doesn't mean they're abusive. They may be opinionated and blunt; that doesn't necessarily mean they're abusive either. And I worry a bit about saints who are simply trying to stand up for themselves being called trouble makers or abusers of the ministry for daring to ask a question like, "Is that really in scripture?" or "Can you support this doctrine with the Word?" Actions and statements by those in authority have more impact than those of laypeople. There are times when a layperson could make a smart remark, and it could just roll off, but if a pastor made the same remark, it would carry more weight and might be considered abusive. (Because presumably people would take it more seriously.)

That said, on to point 2: There are people who can't stand authority figures, who don't like to have anyone even suggest to them how they could live their lives in a more productive way, are jealous of people in leadership, have a bone to pick with the church, etc. They love to pick at, gossip about, harass, interrogate, frustrate and generally cause misery for church staff. Those are the facts. Growing up in a pastor's home and being around other pastors and their families, I know this kind of stuff first hand. Some people are simply downright mean. It's a crying shame that any pastor or his family or other members of the church staff have to deal with people like that, but alas, it really goes with the job, and it can't be helped. Not really. Not unless you want to get out of the people business, and basically spreading the Gospel and caring for God's church is all about being in the people business. You either have to be all about people and all of the baggage (and sometimes garbage) that comes with that or not. You can't have it both ways.

My other thought is: Something can be hurtful and not be abusive.

[DaveC519]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

A couple of things to discuss:

1. Whether or not abuse to an authority figure is quite the same dynamic as abusive behavior by an authority figure, and

2. The very real problem of "saints" who overrun, abuse, bully and harass those in ministry for various reasons.

On the first point, and barring physical abuse or blatant verbal abuse, I would say that it's difficult to interpret what actually comprises abusive behavior. Some people are simply annoying, but that doesn't mean they're abusive. They may be opinionated and blunt; that doesn't necessarily mean they're abusive either. And I worry a bit about saints who are simply trying to stand up for themselves being called trouble makers or abusers of the ministry for daring to ask a question like, "Is that really in scripture?" or "Can you support this doctrine with the Word?" Actions and statements by those in authority have more impact than those of laypeople. There are times when a layperson could make a smart remark, and it could just roll off, but if a pastor made the same remark, it would carry more weight and might be considered abusive. (Because presumably people would take it more seriously.)

That said, on to point 2: There are people who can't stand authority figures, who don't like to have anyone even suggest to them how they could live their lives in a more productive way, are jealous of people in leadership, have a bone to pick with the church, etc. They love to pick at, gossip about, harass, interrogate, frustrate and generally cause misery for church staff. Those are the facts. Growing up in a pastor's home and being around other pastors and their families, I know this kind of stuff first hand. Some people are simply downright mean. It's a crying shame that any pastor or his family or other members of the church staff have to deal with people like that, but alas, it really goes with the job, and it can't be helped. Not really. Not unless you want to get out of the people business, and basically spreading the Gospel and caring for God's church is all about being in the people business. You either have to be all about people and all of the baggage (and sometimes garbage) that comes with that or not. You can't have it both ways.

My other thought is: Something can be hurtful and not be abusive.

Well said!

[kingdomapostle]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

A couple of things to discuss:

1. Whether or not abuse to an authority figure is quite the same dynamic as abusive behavior by an authority figure, and

2. The very real problem of "saints" who overrun, abuse, bully and harass those in ministry for various reasons.

On the first point, and barring physical abuse or blatant verbal abuse, I would say that it's difficult to interpret what actually comprises abusive behavior. Some people are simply annoying, but that doesn't mean they're abusive. They may be opinionated and blunt; that doesn't necessarily mean they're abusive either. And I worry a bit about saints who are simply trying to stand up for themselves being called trouble makers or abusers of the ministry for daring to ask a question like, "Is that really in scripture?" or "Can you support this doctrine with the Word?" Actions and statements by those in authority have more impact than those of laypeople. There are times when a layperson could make a smart remark, and it could just roll off, but if a pastor made the same remark, it would carry more weight and might be considered abusive. (Because presumably people would take it more seriously.)

That said, on to point 2: There are people who can't stand authority figures, who don't like to have anyone even suggest to them how they could live their lives in a more productive way, are jealous of people in leadership, have a bone to pick with the church, etc. They love to pick at, gossip about, harass, interrogate, frustrate and generally cause misery for church staff. Those are the facts. Growing up in a pastor's home and being around other pastors and their families, I know this kind of stuff first hand. Some people are simply downright mean. It's a crying shame that any pastor or his family or other members of the church staff have to deal with people like that, but alas, it really goes with the job, and it can't be helped. Not really. Not unless you want to get out of the people business, and basically spreading the Gospel and caring for God's church is all about being in the people business. You either have to be all about people and all of the baggage (and sometimes garbage) that comes with that or not. You can't have it both ways.

My other thought is: Something can be hurtful and not be abusive.

While I understand where you are coming from, I believe what many clergy members go through (and I know from 18 years experience) is NOT just a few people getting on their nerves. Abuse runs deeply, and because they are the man/woman of God many people just say that they can't possibly be going through any real abuse. I beg to differ. Sacrificing your life for the ministry is already a daily death, but to sacrifice your life while serving ungrateful, rebellious, fault finding, disgruntle people can make you homesick for heaven. I've often witnessed seminars during leadership conferences that will make you cry. One seminar was entitled, "When sheep bite." This should NOT be taken so lightly. I am a BIG advocate for clergy!

[ILG]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

A couple of things to discuss:

1. Whether or not abuse to an authority figure is quite the same dynamic as abusive behavior by an authority figure, and

2. The very real problem of "saints" who overrun, abuse, bully and harass those in ministry for various reasons.

On the first point, and barring physical abuse or blatant verbal abuse, I would say that it's difficult to interpret what actually comprises abusive behavior. Some people are simply annoying, but that doesn't mean they're abusive. They may be opinionated and blunt; that doesn't necessarily mean they're abusive either. And I worry a bit about saints who are simply trying to stand up for themselves being called trouble makers or abusers of the ministry for daring to ask a question like, "Is that really in scripture?" or "Can you support this doctrine with the Word?" Actions and statements by those in authority have more impact than those of laypeople. There are times when a layperson could make a smart remark, and it could just roll off, but if a pastor made the same remark, it would carry more weight and might be considered abusive. (Because presumably people would take it more seriously.)

That said, on to point 2: There are people who can't stand authority figures, who don't like to have anyone even suggest to them how they could live their lives in a more productive way, are jealous of people in leadership, have a bone to pick with the church, etc. They love to pick at, gossip about, harass, interrogate, frustrate and generally cause misery for church staff. Those are the facts. Growing up in a pastor's home and being around other pastors and their families, I know this kind of stuff first hand. Some people are simply downright mean. It's a crying shame that any pastor or his family or other members of the church staff have to deal with people like that, but alas, it really goes with the job, and it can't be helped. Not really. Not unless you want to get out of the people business, and basically spreading the Gospel and caring for God's church is all about being in the people business. You either have to be all about people and all of the baggage (and sometimes garbage) that comes with that or not. You can't have it both ways.

My other thought is: Something can be hurtful and not be abusive.

Good points, Miss B.

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by ILG

Good points, Miss B.

hows that book comming sis?

[ILG]

Originally Posted by acerrak

hows that book comming sis?

Thanks for asking. I'm on chapter 14. I am just now getting into the last church we were at and there is a ton of paperwork to sift through and it is very emotionally draining. I took about a week off just recently. Hope to get back to it soon.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by ILG

Good points, Miss B.

Thanks, ILG!

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Chateau d'If

"Many ministers say they're tempted to throw in the towel or move because of people. Problem people to be exact. I remember the first church I served. After a few months I was approached by a man who felt called by God to be my accountability partner...without asking me. He offered to take me out to eat one day, so I accepted. Little was I prepared for what was about to happen.

Setting down his sandwich he said, "Brian, there are a number of things you are doing wrong, but for the sake of time I've kept my list to 10." I made the mistake of saying, "Start with number one." Two and a half hours later I left with two things--30% less self-esteem and a really good case for why first cousins should never marry.

Like most ministers, I've regularly felt the sting of difficult people. Looking back on some of these situations I've come to one conclusion: in every congregation there are always 3 or 4 blessed souls that are there because no other organization in town will put up with them.

Yes, I agree that it's hard to overestimate the damage some ministers have done to churches. I own that. I know I've caused my share of pain. But it's also healthy to acknowledge that many of God's servants walk with a limp because no-one in their congregation had the guts to stand up to a known troublemaker and protect their leader. It's at those times it becomes easy to question whether the price is too high, at least for me.

Written by Brian Jones

http://www.peopleoffaith.com/pastor-burnout.htm

So very true!