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| Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other. |
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View Poll Results: Where will the lost spend eternity, after final judgement?
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The lake of fire. Eternal torment. Burning forever!!!
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87.50% |
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Not sure. God may grant a pardon. Ya never know.
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12.50% |
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05-10-2007, 12:59 PM
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uncharismatic conservative maverick
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
Yes, confused. No, I'm not Apostolic by the definition that seems to be in effect here on AFF.
Then I am saved. (Of course, many would take exception to my claim to "believe"! And many would claim that my baptism was not valid!)
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Timmy, I hate to bust your proverbial bubble, but none of us are saved yet.
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05-10-2007, 01:04 PM
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Don't ask.
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 24,212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
Timmy, I hate to bust your proverbial bubble, but none of us are saved yet.
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Hmm. I'm guessing this is somewhat TIC, right? Getting kinda over-technical on us? Not saved yet, as in not gone through the final judgement yet?
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05-10-2007, 01:09 PM
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uncharismatic conservative maverick
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
Hmm. I'm guessing this is somewhat TIC, right? Getting kinda over-technical on us? Not saved yet, as in not gone through the final judgement yet?
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The bible says that "he that endureth to the end shall be saved".
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05-10-2007, 01:35 PM
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Don't ask.
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 24,212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
Timmy, got another question for ya. If it was possible to recieve the book of Acts experience, why not recieve it? If you had just a shadow of a doubt about not being baptized and filled with the Holy Ghost, why take that kind of chance? The experience that I recieved is very much real, if you can possibly recieve it, then why not? It just seems to me that you are trying to justify not experiencing all that you could recieve, don't play with your soul like that. Okay, I apologize, that was more than one question.
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Yes, if it's real. A Mormon could make the same argument about their faith. So could Muslims, JWs, etc. Those folks refer to their beliefs as "the truth", just like you folks do. They think they have good reasons for believing as they do, just like you do. Some of them even think they have the correct understanding of the Bible. Just like you!
Like I've said before, I am trying to understand what Apostolics believe. Some of what I've read makes sense. Some does not. And it's been difficult to get info out of some of you guys, sometimes.
(BTW, don't despair for me. I'm sure JWs, e.g., would be even less likely of convincing me of their "truth" than you guys!  )
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
The bible says that "he that endureth to the end shall be saved".
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Well, OK, I've been using the term kind of loosely, then. But isn't that how you folks use the term, too? Some of us are "saved" and some are "unsaved", referring to what would happen if we died right now. Don't you use those terms that way, seriously?
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05-10-2007, 01:51 PM
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uncharismatic conservative maverick
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
Yes, if it's real. A Mormon could make the same argument about their faith. So could Muslims, JWs, etc. Those folks refer to their beliefs as "the truth", just like you folks do. They think they have good reasons for believing as they do, just like you do. Some of them even think they have the correct understanding of the Bible. Just like you!
Like I've said before, I am trying to understand what Apostolics believe. Some of what I've read makes sense. Some does not. And it's been difficult to get info out of some of you guys, sometimes.
( BTW, don't despair for me I'm sure JWs, e.g., would be even less likely of convincing me of their "truth" than you guys! )
Well, OK, I've been using the term kind of loosely, then. But isn't that how you folks use the term, too? Some of us are "saved" and some are "unsaved", referring to what would happen if we died right now. Don't you use those terms that way, seriously?
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Yes, if its real? So, are you saying that what I experienced isn't real? Don't despair for you? WOW! Okay Timmy, you asked the question and I responded. I hope and wish you well.
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05-10-2007, 02:58 PM
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Don't ask.
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 24,212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
Yes, if its real? So, are you saying that what I experienced isn't real? Don't despair for you? WOW! Okay Timmy, you asked the question and I responded. I hope and wish you well.
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Did my "don't despair for me" offend you somehow? I don't understand.
As for whether it's real, I'm not saying it is or isn't. I just said "if". That's what this is all about, isn't it? Me learning what you folks believe, and deciding for myself if I buy it or not? It would be the same for a Mormon forum, or Muslim, or Amway! It's pretty weird for you to get all huffy if I dare suggest that I may not believe what you guys are telling me!
You guys are a lot more certain of your rightness and everyone else's wrongness than most, I think you'll admit. And more certain that your apologetics are iron-clad, and obvious. So, from your point of view, you must be thinking I have a lot of gall, coming in here with questions, and not just automatically believing everything you say. Well, I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but it's not iron-clad or obvious, far as I can tell so far.
I for one am not very certain of my own rightness. That's why I'm here. I'm exploring and searching. I'll leave as soon as you guys give up on me, or I give up trying.
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05-10-2007, 05:52 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
As for whether it's real, I'm not saying it is or isn't. I just said "if". That's what this is all about, isn't it? Me learning what you folks believe, and deciding for myself if I buy it or not?
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Well the "huffy" part is that you add these little comments which sound like snide comments when you say on the one hand you want to know what we believe, but then you add the other comments like what you said to Bro E about dispairing for you. If all you want to do is know what we believe in why then why not stick with just that part?
What does the bible say? I keep stressing this point and you keep saying that's all you are doing but these discussions really do seem to hinge a lot on emotive appeal
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05-10-2007, 05:49 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy
Yes, if it's real. A Mormon could make the same argument about their faith. So could Muslims, JWs, etc. Those folks refer to their beliefs as "the truth", just like you folks do. They think they have good reasons for believing as they do, just like you do. Some of them even think they have the correct understanding of the Bible. Just like you!
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Bro Eastman though is referring to a biblical truth and not merely a "faith". If Mormons pointed to the bible and said "Look God heals" I would agree with them that this is a biblical experience. Bro E is here talking about the baptism of the Holy Spirit, which is a biblical experience.
You know even early Methodists during the time of Wesley experienced speaking in tongues. Are you saying it is not real?
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