A Picture of Jesus

[bbyrd009]

But ok, if you translate Gen 4:1 that way,
which I understand, you are left with no other Scriptural support,
but must refute several verses to the contrary.

I'll admit it seems contradictory at first;
I did hear an illuminating message on this,
years ago, but I've forgotten the argument now-
-I remem it's even better than "ya,
that would be the first time a pregnant woman
'got pregnant' by a cuckolded man."

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

But ok, if you translate Gen 4:1 that way,
which I understand, you are left with no other Scriptural support,
but must refute several verses to the contrary.

I'll admit it seems contradictory at first;
I did hear an illuminating message on this,
years ago, but I've forgotten the argument now-
-I remem it's even better than "ya,
that would be the first time a pregnant woman
'got pregnant' by a cuckolded man."

your way of translation is probably not the proper way since it does say adam is cain's father.

genesis 4:1 is very explicit

vat·ta·har וַתַּ֙הַר֙ to conceive, become pregnant

in order to be pregnent adam had to
had relations יָדַ֖ע ya·da 3045 to know. they had sex dude

[Sam]

By our first birth we are children of the devil.
By our second birth we are children of God.

Jesus told those very religious folks back there, "Ye are of your father the devil" in John 8:44. Ephesians 2 says that we are by nature (our human nature that we inherited at our first birth) the children of wrath, that BC (before Christ comes in) we are spiritually dead. In 1 John 3:12 it says that "Cain...was of that wicked one....". In my opinion, this means Cain as well as all of the rest of us were born into a fallen family and were under the control of satan. It does not mean that satan physically fathered us.

I have read several of Bro. Willliam Branham's sermons over the year. He taught that before Adam and Eve came together sexually, she had already had sex with satan and was pregnant with Cain. So according to the way Bro. Branham taught, Eve was the mother of Cain but Adam was not his father and Eve was the mother of Abel and Adam was Abel's father.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by Sam

By our first birth we are children of the devil.
By our second birth we are children of God.

Jesus told those very religious folks back there, "Ye are of your father the devil" in John 8:44. Ephesians 2 says that we are by nature (our human nature that we inherited at our first birth) the children of wrath, that BC (before Christ comes in) we are spiritually dead. In 1 John 3:12 it says that "Cain...was of that wicked one....". In my opinion, this means Cain as well as all of the rest of us were born into a fallen family and were under the control of satan. It does not mean that satan physically fathered us.

I have read several of Bro. Willliam Branham's sermons over the year. He taught that before Adam and Eve came together sexually, she had already had sex with satan and was pregnant with Cain. So according to the way Bro. Branham taught, Eve was the mother of Cain but Adam was not his father and Eve was the mother of Abel and Adam was Abel's father.

but good point, at "Noah."
See that scholars have been arguing this forever, and I doubt
that we'll settle anything here. I mean this to strictly be an alt
reflection, for consideration--the pov of satan as "spiritual father"
works fine, until you start to talk Ish and Adam, etc.

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by Sam

I have read several of Bro. Willliam Branham's sermons over the year. He taught that before Adam and Eve came together sexually, she had already had sex with satan and was pregnant with Cain. So according to the way Bro. Branham taught, Eve was the mother of Cain but Adam was not his father and Eve was the mother of Abel and Adam was Abel's father.

I looked up that sermon it is well document. he is very wrong on his interpretation on scriptures with such things, saying the devil placed his seed in her. he had a hard time trying to explain how she praised God for the devil child that God helped her deliver. pretty bad.

I can understand the Spiritual understand cain was wicked, but that was not what he was after he was littleraly saying the devil fathered that child.

and that eve went from walking with God to being possesed by the devil. There is a huge difference in the word beguile and possessed.

i dont know about his other works but this sermon was nonsense.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by acerrak

your way of translation is probably not the proper way since it does say adam is cain's father.

genesis 4:1 is very explicit

vat·ta·har וַתַּ֙הַר֙ to conceive, become pregnant

in order to be pregnent adam had to
had relations יָדַ֖ע ya·da 3045 to know. they had sex dude

Ok, yes. "It" also says that satan is Cain's father, NT,
and Cain is not in Adam's geneology, is that like a typo?
Adam surely raised Cain, no pun intended.
None of these is "my way of translation,"
please understand I'm just parroting masters,
and I don't have all the answers either.

But I know who Cain's father was, to my satisfaction,
and you do to yours. Amen.

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Ok, yes. "It" also says that satan is Cain's father, NT,
and Cain is not in Adam's geneology, is that like a typo?
Adam surely raised Cain, no pun intended.
None of these is "my way of translation,"
please understand I'm just parroting masters,
and I don't have all the answers either.

But I know who Cain's father was, to my satisfaction,
and you do to yours. Amen.

that is noahs geneology from adam. notice it doesnt say abel in the geneology either. cause it is showing the link of Noah through Seth, not cain or able. again you cant get passed ch 4:1 and the genoeology supports the family line of noah through seth, all of the other decendants was destroyed in the flood. You also notice that after the flood the kids have there family time line started.


also like i said ch 4 plainly said it, this from the NIV

Genesis 4
Cain and Abel
1 Adam made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, “With the help of the LORD I have brought forth a man.” 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by acerrak

that is noahs geneology from adam. notice it doesnt say abel in the geneology either. cause it is showing the link of Noah through Seth, not cain or able. again you cant get passed ch 4:1 and the genoeology supports the family line of noah through seth, all of the other decendants was destroyed in the flood. You also notice that after the flood the kids have there family time line started.


also like i said ch 4 plainly said it, this from the NIV

Genesis 4
Cain and Abel
1 Adam made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, “With the help of the LORD I have brought forth a man.” 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.

Ok, but understand that we read like children, too literally;
and NIV? Please? You need to toss that garbage anyway.
Understand that there are many other possible translations
of any one Scripture, and if you read the primitive text of any one,
you are going to go "how the heck did they get this from that?"

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Ok, but understand that we read like children, too literally;
and NIV? Please? You need to toss that garbage anyway.
Understand that there are many other possible translations
of any one Scripture, and if you read the primitive text of any one,
you are going to go "how the heck did they get this from that?"

the niv is a decent translation, the king james is a ok translation, however you just dont want to admit your wrong on the subject.

however i am willing to go back to the hebrew with you on this and i would love to see how you translate word for word genesis chapter 4;1