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Old 01-24-2013, 08:12 AM
deacon blues deacon blues is offline
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Re: BOTT 2013 Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferd View Post
You sure about that? Go back and read the story of Moses and Pharoh. Read the NT where the bible talks about people being turned over to a reprobate mind.

..2 Thessalonians 2:11 (KJV)
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
...
Someone said on another forum: "The language of 'God sending a delusion' is one thing to sort out--- but the idea that He's telling people BOTH truth and a lie and they need to able to tell the difference because they are both simultaneously from him is another."
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‎When a newspaper posed the question, "What's Wrong with the World?" G. K. Chesterton reputedly wrote a brief letter in response: "Dear Sirs: I am. Sincerely Yours, G. K. Chesterton." That is the attitude of someone who has grasped the message of Jesus.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:40 AM
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Ferd Ferd is offline
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Re: BOTT 2013 Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by deacon blues View Post
Someone said on another forum: "The language of 'God sending a delusion' is one thing to sort out--- but the idea that He's telling people BOTH truth and a lie and they need to able to tell the difference because they are both simultaneously from him is another."
I didnt get that from the quote. And further I dont have the context of the quote. I seriously dont think that is what the speaker was saying.

That being said, I have certainly seen preachers who thought they had revelation and I stood in wonder at their delusion.
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Old 01-24-2013, 05:43 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: BOTT 2013 Quote

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Originally Posted by deacon blues View Post
Someone said on another forum: "The language of 'God sending a delusion' is one thing to sort out--- but the idea that He's telling people BOTH truth and a lie and they need to able to tell the difference because they are both simultaneously from him is another."
Barnes
God shall send them strong delusion - Greek: “energy of deceit;” a Hebraism, meaning strong deceit, The agency of God is here distinctly recognised, in accordance with the uniform statements of the Scriptures, respecting evil; compare Exo_7:13; Exo_9:12; Exo_10:1, Exo_10:20, Exo_10:27; Exo_11:10; Exo_14:8. Isa_45:7. On the nature of this agency, see the notes on Joh_12:40. It is not necessary here to suppose that there was any positive influence on the part of God in causing this delusion to come upon them, but all the force of the language will be met, as well as the reasoning of the apostle, by supposing that God withdrew all restraint, and suffered men simply to show that they did not love the truth. God often places people in circumstances to develop their own nature, and it cannot be shown to be wrong that He should do so. If people have no love of the truth, and no desire to be saved, it is not improper that they should be allowed to manifest this. How it happened that they had no “love of the truth,” is a different question, to which the remarks of the apostle do not appertain; compare Rom_9:17-18, note; Rom_1:24, note.
That they should believe a lie - This does not affirm that God wished them to believe a lie; nor that He would not have preferred that they should believe the truth; nor that He exerted any direct agency to cause them to believe a lie. It means merely that He left them, because they did not love the truth, to believe what was false, and what would end in their destruction. Can anyone doubt that this constantly occurs in the world? People are left to believe impostors; to trust to false guides; to rely on unfounded information; to credit those who live to delude and betray the innocent; and to follow those who lead them to ruin. God does not interpose by direct power to preserve them. Can anyone doubt this? Yet this is not especially the doctrine of revelation. The fact pertains just as much to the infidel as it does to the believer in Christianity, and he is just as much bound to explain it as the Christian is. It belongs to our world - to us all - and it should not be charged on Christianity as a doctrine pertaining especially to that system.
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Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
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Old 01-25-2013, 07:11 AM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Re: BOTT 2013 Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas View Post
Barnes
God shall send them strong delusion - Greek: “energy of deceit;” a Hebraism, meaning strong deceit, The agency of God is here distinctly recognised, in accordance with the uniform statements of the Scriptures, respecting evil; compare Exo_7:13; Exo_9:12; Exo_10:1, Exo_10:20, Exo_10:27; Exo_11:10; Exo_14:8. Isa_45:7. On the nature of this agency, see the notes on Joh_12:40. It is not necessary here to suppose that there was any positive influence on the part of God in causing this delusion to come upon them, but all the force of the language will be met, as well as the reasoning of the apostle, by supposing that God withdrew all restraint, and suffered men simply to show that they did not love the truth. God often places people in circumstances to develop their own nature, and it cannot be shown to be wrong that He should do so. If people have no love of the truth, and no desire to be saved, it is not improper that they should be allowed to manifest this. How it happened that they had no “love of the truth,” is a different question, to which the remarks of the apostle do not appertain; compare Rom_9:17-18, note; Rom_1:24, note.
That they should believe a lie - This does not affirm that God wished them to believe a lie; nor that He would not have preferred that they should believe the truth; nor that He exerted any direct agency to cause them to believe a lie. It means merely that He left them, because they did not love the truth, to believe what was false, and what would end in their destruction. Can anyone doubt that this constantly occurs in the world? People are left to believe impostors; to trust to false guides; to rely on unfounded information; to credit those who live to delude and betray the innocent; and to follow those who lead them to ruin. God does not interpose by direct power to preserve them. Can anyone doubt this? Yet this is not especially the doctrine of revelation. The fact pertains just as much to the infidel as it does to the believer in Christianity, and he is just as much bound to explain it as the Christian is. It belongs to our world - to us all - and it should not be charged on Christianity as a doctrine pertaining especially to that system.
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