The Security of the Believer

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Sure, no problem. My elaboration is very simple, in the Mark 13 parable the tree which was cut down never bore fruit. It was dead from the beginning.

Who planted it? Why did Jesus require that it bear fruit?

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Who planted it? Why did Jesus require that it bear fruit?

Doesn't matter who planted it, it was a non producing tree from the beginning. If it didn't bear fruit, it was of no value. Notice that it wasn't a tree which was bearing fruit and because of the decisions of the tree it chose not to bear fruit any longer and ordered cut down because of it's decisions.

[PastorTLArt]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Doesn't matter who planted it, it was a non producing tree from the beginning. If it didn't bear fruit, it was of no value. Notice that it wasn't a tree which was bearing fruit and because of the decisions of the tree it chose not to bear fruit any longer and ordered cut down because of it's decisions.

May I ask how this Parable equates to the Doctrine of Eternal Security?

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by PastorTLArt

May I ask how this Parable equates to the Doctrine of Eternal Security?

I'm assuming that Michael is attempting to draw a parallel between the cutting of the tree as equivalent to God destroying one of His trees (children). Personally, I don't think the parable has anything to do with eternal security.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Doesn't matter who planted it, it was a non producing tree from the beginning. If it didn't bear fruit, it was of no value. Notice that it wasn't a tree which was bearing fruit and because of the decisions of the tree it chose not to bear fruit any longer and ordered cut down because of it's decisions.

It was JESUS who made the decision to cut the tree down. He was going to cut it down after 2 years. Someone interceded so he gave it another year to bear fruit. If it did not his vinedresser was given the order to CUT IT DOWN.

See JESUS is sovereign concerning salvation. Man is not allowed to have the final say. One may think "I have time to change later if I decide I want to". He does not know the line has already been drawn by Jesus.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Who planted it? Why did Jesus require that it bear fruit?

Of course, commentaries are simply opinion, but I thought this was interesting.

"Others are only nominal professors; and are like a fig tree, of which sort was this in the parable, that has large leaves, but no fruit; make a large profession, but bring forth no fruit to the glory of God; and though they are planted in the house of God, yet not by God the Father, nor by Christ, only at best by ministers and churches hoping well of them, but mistaken in them:" - John Gill

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Of course, commentaries are simply opinion, but I thought this was interesting.

"Others are only nominal professors; and are like a fig tree, of which sort was this in the parable, that has large leaves, but no fruit; make a large profession, but bring forth no fruit to the glory of God; and though they are planted in the house of God, yet not by God the Father, nor by Christ, only at best by ministers and churches hoping well of them, but mistaken in them:" - John Gill

But JESUS is the one who planted the tree.

It was HIS SEED.

It bore no fruit. He gave it TIME. See how that works? Was Jesus giving a mere PROFESSOR more time to bare fruit?

Or does he give his own children time? This is so clear.

Jesus NEVER promises eternal life to anyone who is not overcoming. He always warns that those who dont do his will will be lost.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Of course, commentaries are simply opinion, but I thought this was interesting.

"Others are only nominal professors; and are like a fig tree, of which sort was this in the parable, that has large leaves, but no fruit; make a large profession, but bring forth no fruit to the glory of God; and though they are planted in the house of God, yet not by God the Father, nor by Christ, only at best by ministers and churches hoping well of them, but mistaken in them:" - John Gill

And this does contain truth. MOST of the people that attend Church or claim to be Christians may well be what Jesus called "tares".

Seed planted by satan. They were never true Christians. satan was using them to confuse true Christians. They continue to sin because having not the Holy Spirit they cannot do otherwise.

True Christians see someone who is supposedly "saved" still sinning. They reason hmmm if they can do it and be a Christian why not me?

Many Preachers are tares also. They love to tell people "you dont have to be perfect". Exactly what the devil wants them to believe Then they no longer strive to enter the kingdom and just like Jesus said they wind up being shut out.

So the bottom line is only those who DO the will of God will wind up in the kingdom. This is taught everywhere in the Bible.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Matt. 7:21

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

But JESUS is the one who planted the tree.

It was HIS SEED.

It bore no fruit. He gave it TIME. See how that works? Was Jesus giving a mere PROFESSOR more time to bare fruit?

Or does he give his own children time? This is so clear.

Jesus NEVER promises eternal life to anyone who is not overcoming. He always warns that those who don't do his will will be lost.

I agree with you. I Corinthians 3:5-9, the "seed" being the Word of God (Luke 8:11)

"Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase. Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. 9For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

And this does contain truth. MOST of the people that attend Church or claim to be Christians may well be what Jesus called "tares".

Seed planted by satan. They were never true Christians. satan was using them to confuse true Christians. They continue to sin because having not the Holy Spirit they cannot do otherwise.

True Christians see someone who is supposedly "saved" still sinning. They reason hmmm if they can do it and be a Christian why not me?

Many Preachers are tares also. They love to tell people "you dont have to be perfect". Exactly what the devil wants them to believe Then they no longer strive to enter the kingdom and just like Jesus said they wind up being shut out.

So the bottom line is only those who DO the will of God will wind up in the kingdom. This is taught everywhere in the Bible.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Matt. 7:21

And I agree with you here also, as in this instance, the "seed" is from satan - "But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way." Matthew 13:25