End Time Army of Women Preachers Psalms 68:11

[Sister Alvear]

Do you thing the ladies went off to some corner and had a knitting party? I would think they were doing what Clement was doing in (Phil. 4:2-3). And note carefully what the apostle says with regard to these ladies of the early church.:..“And I entreat you also, true yokefellow, help those WOMEN who LABORED WITH ME in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other of my fellow laborers, whose names are in the book of life” (Phil 4:3)...

Philippians 4:2-3
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
2 I encourage both Euodia and Syntyche to have the attitude the Lord wants them to have. 3 Yes, I also ask you, Syzugus, my true partner, to help these women. They fought beside me to spread the Good News along with Clement and the rest of my coworkers, whose names are in the Book of Life.

When he describes the ministry of Euodia and Syntyche, Paul uses a couple of the same terms he had previously applied to Timothy and Epaphroditus. Paul writes that Euodia and Syntyche had contended[3] together with him (literally) “in the Gospel”. Earlier in the same letter, Paul had also described Timothy as someone who had served with him “in the Gospel” (Php 2:22). Paul goes on to refer to Euodia and Syntyche as his “co-workers”. Earlier, Paul had also referred to Epaphroditus as his “co-worker” (Php 2:25).[4] Thus, according to Paul, the ministries of these women were comparable to the ministries of the men, Timothy and Epaphroditus.

So my dear friend men and women went everywhere preaching....

[Sister Alvear]

Psalm 68:11
The Lord gave the word: great was the company of those that published it.
I quote KATHARINE BUSHNELL [1855 – 1946] :
“David himself ordered the appointment of men among women to prophesy in song. Moreover, David and the captains of the host separated to the service of the sons of Asaph, Heman, and Jeduthun, who should prophesy with harps, with psalteries, and with cymbals . . .And, God gave Heman fourteen sons and three daughters. All these were under the hands of their father for song in the House of the Lord with cymbals, psalteries, and harps for the service of the House of God. (I Chron. 25:1, 5, 6)
But, it was not alone for music that women prophesied. David in prophetic vision sees that “The Lord giveth the word: the women that publish the tidings are a great host.” (Psalm 68:11). Not only were women permitted to preach the tidings but commanded in the Old Testament to do so when the Gospel dispensation opened. The prophecy in the Psalms was hidden from view for a long time by incorrect translation. The revisers have given us its true sense. Had they been willing to translate with equal fairness another passage, we should have had more light on this subject. By comparing this passage in the Psalms with one in Isaiah (40:9), we discover that they employ in the original one and the same word in the same part of speech, participial in each instance, for the word translated in the Psalm, “publish the tidings.” Both are in the feminine gender, the only difference, in fact, being that one word is singular and the other plural in number.
The chapter in Isaiah in which this verse appears opens with a commandment to comfort My people because their warfare is ended. Then follow the words, “The voice of one crying in the wilderness,” indicating with certainty the period to which the prophecy relates. Then at the 9th verse occur words which, if translated with the same spirit of fairness as at Psalm 68:11, would read in English, “O woman that publishest good tidings: to Zion, get thee up into the high mountain; O woman, that publishest good tidings to Jerusalem, lift up thy voice with strength lift: it up, be not afraid; say, unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God!” Dr. Adam Clarke, in his commentary, prints some interesting notes on this passage. Not only was woman, then, permitted to publish, the tidings under the Old Covenant, but also she was commanded, under the Old, to do so at the opening of the New, and it was prophesied under the Old that she should do so both by Joel and by David.” (God’s Word to Women, Katharine Bushnell)
Psalm 68:11, other translations
Psalm 68:11 (ESV)
The Lord gives the word;
the women who announce the news are a great host:
Psalm 68:11 (EXB)
The Lord gave the command,
 and a great ·army [or company of women] told the news:
Psalm 68:11 (GNT)
The Lord gave the command,
 and many women carried the news:
Psalm 68:11 (NET) |
The Lord speaks; 
many, many women spread the good news.
Isaiah 40 prophesies the preaching of the gospel:
Isaiah 40:9
O Zion, that bringest good tidings, get thee up into the high mountain; O Jerusalem, that bringest good tidings, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God!
Adam Clarkes’ commentary on Isaiah 40:9 is interesting.
“O Zion, that bringest good tidings “O daughter, that bringest glad tidings to Zion”" – That the true construction of the sentence is this, which makes Zion the receiver, not the publisher, of the glad tidings, which latter has been the most prevailing interpretation, will, I think, very clearly appear, if we rightly consider the image itself, and the custom and common practice from which it is taken. I have added the word daughter to express the feminine gender of the Hebrew participle, which I know not how to do otherwise in our language; and this is absolutely necessary in order to ascertain the image. For the office of announcing and celebrating such glad tidings as are here spoken of, belongs peculiarly to the women.
On occasion of any great public success, a signal victory, or any other joyful event, it was usual for the women to gather together, and with music, dances, and songs, to publish and celebrate the happy news. Thus after the passage of the Red Sea, Miriam, and all the women, with timbrels in their hands, formed a chorus, and joined the men in their triumphant song, dancing, and throwing in alternately the refrain or burden of the song:- “Sing ye to JEHOVAH, for he is greatly exalted; The horse and his rider hath he cast into the sea.” Exod. xv. 20, 21.
So Jephthah’s daughter collected a chorus or virgins, and with dances and songs came out to meet her father, and to celebrate his victory, Judg. xi. 34. After David’s conquest of Goliath, “all the women came out of the cities of Israel singing and dancing to meet Saul, with tabrets, with joy, and with instruments of music; ” and, forming themselves into two choruses, they sang alternately:- “Saul has slain his thousands: And David his ten thousands.” 1 Sam. xviii. 6, 7.
And this gives us the true sense of a passage in the sixty- eighth Psalm, which has frequently been misunderstood:- “JEHOVAH gave the word, (that is, the joyful news,) The women, who published the glad tidings, were a great company; The kings of mighty armies did flee, did flee: And even the matron, who stayed at home, shared the spoil.” The word signifying the publishers of glad tidings is the same, and expressed in the same form by the feminine participle, as in this place, and the last distich is the song which they sang. So in this place, JEHOVAH having given the word by his prophet, the joyful tidings of the restoration of Zion, and of God’s returning to Jerusalem, (see chap. lii. 8,) the women are exhorted by the prophet to publish the joyful news with a loud voice from eminences, whence they might best be heard all over the country; and the matter and burden of their song was to be, “Behold your God! ” See on Psa. lxviii.

[Sister Alvear]

“And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.” (Acts 18:26).

Apollos is “expounded” to by a man and woman named Pricilla and Aquila. If the woman was not to teach a man at all, then Apollos would have sinned in listening to a woman “expound” to him “the way of God more perfectly”. If women were not to be used in instructing a man being in violation of 1 Timothy 2:12, then Priscilla would have disobeyed the ordinances of God. However, we find no reproof or correction for her in the Word of God, but she did in truth obey God in instructing the man along with her husband. Priscilla was in right standing with her husband as her head and still preached and instructed Apollos in the way. The name mentioned first in scripture has the dominance in speaking usually being the man mentioned first then the wife. However, Priscilla is mentioned first before her husband in Acts 18:1-4; Acts 18:18-28; Romans 16:3,4; 1 Corinthians 16:19; and 2 Timothy 2:14.

[n david]

Church Leadership Link

"Elect Lady Pastor..." (Female and the Wife)
"First Man and 2nd Assistant Pastor..." (Male and the Husband)

He's not even the Assistant Pastor, he's the 2nd Assistant Pastor!

Somewhere RDP's head will explode when he sees this!

IMO, this just isn't right, sorry ladies.

[Sister Alvear]

now back to Clement....

Indeed, years later when Paul wrote his epistle to the Philippians, it is interesting and perhaps quite telling that the only individuals he mentioned by name were two women, Euodias and Syntyche, and one man named
(Phil. 4:2-3). And note carefully what the apostle says with regard to these three characters:..“And I entreat you also, true yokefellow, help those WOMEN who LABORED WITH ME in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other of my fellow laborers, whose names are in the book of life” (Phil 4:3)...

You will see that Paul makes no distinction among Clement, Euodias, and Syntyche... All of them are considered as those who labored together with Paul in preaching the gospel... The Greek word rendered labored in verse 3 means to wrestle in company with... The wording in the passage clearly indicates that all of these believer, male and female alike, were engaged side-by-side in preaching, teaching, counseling, and watching over the ministerial work that was being accomplished in that part of the world...

Anyone who believes that a woman is forbidden by the Almighty to teach had better take the issue up with Him personally, because in the case of Priscilla, she was gifted as a teacher and she actively taught as one... It is quite obvious that Paul thought highly of both her and her husband, for he says in Romans 16:“Greet Priscilla and Aquila my HELPERS in Christ Jesus: who for my life laid down THEIR OWN NECKS: unto whom not only I give thanks, but also ALL THE CHURCHES OF THE GENTILES... Likewise greet the church that is IN THEIR HOUSE” (Rom. 16:3-5)...The Greek word for helpers in verse 3 is sunergos, and it means co-laborer, companion in labor, laborer together with...

[Sister Alvear]

It does not mean peon, babysitter, table server, or maid!!.. When Paul says that Priscilla and Aquila risked their own necks to save his life, this has to be a reference to major involvement in the difficult work in which the apostle himself was engaged... These two believers were willing to host an assembly in their home in Rome, and yet travel across the sea to foreign lands hundreds and hundreds of miles away, preaching and teaching the gospel message to the Gentiles...

Basicly the same thing I have done for the past 46 years on the mission field...sowing the gospel seed....

[Sister Alvear]

Paul considered them fellow laborers, doing the same kind of work... In fact, there is even a sense of equality suggested in the language Paul uses with respect to these two servants, as well as certain others... The apostle saw these brethren as a team of workers, each of them, men and women alike, ready, willing, and able to give up all for the Messiah, even to putting their own lives on the line!.. Clearly, Paul had no problem with women serving to the maximum in getting the initial groundwork of the kingdom successfully laid...

[Sister Alvear]

Let's look at another source...

Romans 16:3‑5 - Greet (1) Priscilla and Aquila my (2) helpers in Christ Jesus:.. [4] Who have for my life laid down their own necks: unto whom not only I give thanks, but also all the churches of the Gentiles... [5] Likewise greet the church that is in their house. Salute my well beloved Epaenetus, who is the firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ.....(1)...... Priscilla, pris'‑cil‑lah, Greek 4252; diminative of Greek 4251 (*Priska); Priscilla (i.e. little Prisca), a Christian woman :‑ Priscilla...·.............. Priska, pris'‑kah, Greek 4251; of Latin origin; feminine of Priscus, ancient; Priska, a Christian woman :‑ Prisca... See also Greek 4252 (Priscilla)...(2) (helpers).. ..sunergos, soon‑er‑gos', Greek 4904; from a presumed compound of Greek 4862 (sun) and the base of Greek 2041 (ergon); a co‑laborer, i.e. coadjutor :‑ companion in labour, (fellow‑) helper (‑labourer, ‑worker), labourer together with, workfellow...

[Sister Alvear]

Originally Posted by n david

Church Leadership Link

"Elect Lady Pastor..." (Female and the Wife)
"First Man and 2nd Assistant Pastor..." (Male and the Husband)

He's not even the Assistant Pastor, he's the 2nd Assistant Pastor!

Somewhere RDP's head will explode when he sees this!

IMO, this just isn't right, sorry ladies.

my opionion of the elect lady is that she was a pastor or overseer of a group of people (believers)

Certainly it would be simple enough to conjecture that John is merely addressing an assembly of believers, referring to them collectively as the elect lady and her children... This could possibly have been done to conceal the reality of the recipients were the letter to fall into enemy hands... There are, however, reasonable arguments against such a conclusion...First of all, since III John is expressly directed to an individual by name, why not take the same special precautions presumed to be the case in the second epistle?.. Furthermore, the certain wording in this brief letter makes it awkward to think of John referring to a church by the term lady... Notice the following passage:.. “I rejoiced greatly that I found of your CHILDREN walking in truth, as we have received a commandment from the father... And now I beseech you, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment, but that which we had from the beginning, that we should love one another” (I Jn. 4-5)...Here the apostle first refers to the children of the lady, then begins to give specific instructions to the lady... Since the children obviously comprise the local assembly, how can the lady be the church? Believers are not considered children of the church, but rather the children of their teacher or leader, just the way John himself was with respect to the Messiah... Indeed, Paul uses this same sort of description when he says:..“My little CHILDREN, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you” (Gal. 4:19)...“O you Corinthians, our mouth is open unto you, our heart is enlarged...Now for a recompense in the same, (I speak as unto my CHILDREN) be you also enlarged” (II Cor. 6:11, 13)...Even John himself follows this same practice in his third epistle, stating:..“I have no greater joy than to hear that MY CHILDREN walk in the truth” (III Jn. 4)...
The statement, therefore, in II John 1 sounds much more like the apostle is addressing a person when he says lady, and the collective church members when he uses the word children... To delve just a little more deeply into this passage, it is very interesting that John actually addresses his second epistle in the Greek to the eklektee kuria... The first word means chosen of God, but it is the second term that is most compelling... Kuria is the feminine form of the word kurios, and means supreme in authority, controller... In the masculine form, it is rendered lord, in the feminine, lady... It would therefore appear that this is indeed an individual person, that she is female in gender, and that she holds a position of leadership in one of the early congregations in Asia Minor to whom John wrote and traveled during his ministry..... (copied)


I do have quite a bit of material about the elect lady but do not have time to share it...but maybe at some point....

Sorry so many bits and peices....

[n david]

Thank you Sis Alvear and RDP for the lively debate. I've been following along and am enjoying this.

I have no issues with women preachers or teachers, though I don't believe women should be Pastors.

One question, Sis Alvear - How do you interpret Phil 4:2-3 and Romans 16:3-5 to mean these women were preaching with Paul? There are many ways someone can be a co-laborer or helper. I see nothing in these scriptures or elsewhere where it's written these women preached or taught. It's really adding something that isn't there to say they did so.

The Greek you posted also doesn't mention preaching or teaching. Is there something else written either in the Bible or historical accounts which proves these women did, or is this just your added interpretation?