Universal Salvation

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Wise words. The point is that it is pointless for us NOW, if it is true. Even if there WILL be an age ahead that redeems everyone ever lost, it is irrelevant to us today since we are still to deny the flesh and learn to be Spirit led, etc. So I deem the issue to be futile, since the bible clearly does not plainly state things about it, if it was true, compared to what the bible DOES speak about plainly.

To the contrary, the doctrine of endless torment has turned multitudes from God, because by it very nature blasphemes the character of our Heavenly Father. Let's start with the simplicity of (1 Cor. 13.8) LOVE NEVER FAILS,

"The teaching of endless torment, negatively effects the preaching of the gospel, "eternal" hell...

Maligns God's character before the world.
Contradicts His unending and unfailing love for all people.
Makes our worship stem from fear instead of true affection.
Denies His unlimited power to accomplish His will.
Makes man's will greater than God's will.
Infinitely minimizes Jesus' triumph over Satan.
Denies Jesus fully accomplished His mission on earth.
Negates the most glorious promises in the Bible.
Ignores the testimony of the early church.
Rob us of peace and joy.
AFFECTS WHAT WE BECOME; LIKE FATHER--LIKE SON.
Hinders world evangelism.

Hell is a horrifying thought. Millions have been terrorized by it. Some have even killed their children to spare them such a fate. If we would truly grasp the horror of it, we would go insane. Our every waking moment would have to be spent snatching whoever we can out of the fire or nothing but constant guilt would torment us. Can you imagine the horror of suffering "forever"? What is a billion years? It is but a second in eternity. Who could possibly imagine such horror? What if you or one of your loved ones should go there? Does this thought affect how you feel about God?

This theme has gripped my heart as it afflicts millions of people and dishonors God before the world. After years of wrestling with this topic, studying the Bible, and reading the works of others, I have found that hell is a judgment given from the disciplinary hand of a loving Father. Though severe, it serves a good and remedial purpose."

One of our greatest presidents agreed. In Abraham Lincoln the Christian, William Johnson, stated:

Abraham Lincoln did not nor could not believe in the endless punishment of anyone of the human race. He understood punishment for sin to be a Bible doctrine; that the punishment was parental in its object, aim and design, and intended for the good of the offender; hence it must cease when justice is satisfied. All that was lost by the transgression of Adam was made good by the atonement.

Quoted for "Hope Beyond Hell" by Gerry Beauchemin

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by crakjak

To the contrary, the doctrine of endless torment has turned multitudes from God, because by it very nature blasphemes the character of our Heavenly Father. Let's start with the simplicity of (1 Cor. 13.8) LOVE NEVER FAILS,

When a conqueror conquers a nation, and some who resist end up suffering and dying, that does not mean the conqueror failed. He succeeded in conquering. Similarly, just because some souls are damned, that does not mean Christ failed.

"The teaching of endless torment, negatively effects the preaching of the gospel, "eternal" hell...

Maligns God's character before the world.
Contradicts His unending and unfailing love for all people.
Makes our worship stem from fear instead of true affection.
Denies His unlimited power to accomplish His will.
Makes man's will greater than God's will.
Infinitely minimizes Jesus' triumph over Satan.
Denies Jesus fully accomplished His mission on earth.
Negates the most glorious promises in the Bible.
Ignores the testimony of the early church.
Rob us of peace and joy.
AFFECTS WHAT WE BECOME; LIKE FATHER--LIKE SON.
Hinders world evangelism.

The bottom line is there is no clear statement about any of this sort of thing in the bible. We can REASON anything away. But to take a verse that says love never fails and to ride on it to such extreme extents that have nothing to do with the context in which the verse was written, such as no one winding up lost, is beyond reason.

The catholics reasoned and reasoned until they came up with all sorts of concoted doctrines, like real presence and Mariolatry. Meanwhile the bible never plainly says those things. I really think it is a diverting doctrine taht sways one away from the practical here and now needs.