What is SIN?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

According to 1 John sin is unrighteousness, and transgression of the law.

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Apparently John is the only writer in scripture that actually says "sin is" and defines what sin is. Correct me if I'm wrong? There are a lot of scriptures about sin, but is 1 John is the only place where sin is actually defined as "sin is"?

I believe that is correct.

Then John says:

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

... "he that committeth sin is of the devil..."

In light of that passage, how exactly do we define WHAT is sin?

Sin is transgression of the law. Therefore whatever is a transgression of the law of God is sin. Dishonouring your parents is sin. Stealing is sin. Adultery is sin. Why? Because those things are violations of the law of God (transgressions).

The word sin however is also used to describe not merely the action which is forbidden, but (in the case of idolatry) the object which is sinfully (ie unlawfully) worshipped, or the place where such unlarful worship occurs. For example:

Hos_10:8 The high places also of Aven, the sin of Israel, shall be destroyed: the thorn and the thistle shall come up on their altars; and they shall say to the mountains, Cover us; and to the hills, Fall on us.

Amo_8:14 They that swear by the sin of Samaria, and say, Thy god, O Dan, liveth; and, The manner of Beersheba liveth; even they shall fall, and never rise up again.

But sin is defined Biblically as trangression of the law. The law defines and identifies sin:

Rom_7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Jesus, of course, in the Sermon on the Mount, explained the spiritual application, and extent, of the law to not merely the outward physical action but to the intent of the heart as well, as when he identified unlawful lust as a form of adultery.

Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

As for 'the devil', the word devil means 'accuser'. It is a term that is taken from the concept of satan being one who accuses the people of God of their sins (see Job, etc). So the 'devil' is generally a NT term for 'satan', which is a Hebrew word for 'adversary' or 'enemy'. So then the 'devil' is the Adversary, that is, one who is opposed to God, his dominion (law), his grace, his divine Plan, etc. The devil 'sins from the beginning', that is, the enemy of God is in transgression, and is from the beginning. One who sins, ie one who transgresses God's law, is 'of the devil', much as Christ said to the Pharisees 'You are of your father the devil'. Being a 'child of' someone is a Hebrew figure of speech (a Hebraism) meaning one is partaking of the characteristic of someone, as if they were biologically descended from that someone. So the sinner is one who follows in the devil's footsteps, and bears the likeness of the devil - the enemy or opposer of God.

Thus, sin is the opposing of God and His ways, which are revealed in the law as explained and understood by the gospel.

[Godsdrummer]

Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

Yes, BUT...

What defines 'good'?

And thus we come back to the law of God, which is in effect the knowledge of what is good and what is evil, is it not?

Since by the law is the knowledge of sin, it follows that the law reveals what is good and what is bad. Good is the obedience to the commandment, and evil is disobedience (transgression) of the commandment.

And further, as a side note, this is why Adam and Eve were forbidden to 'eat the fruit' of the 'tree of the knowledge of good and evil' - that is, they were forbidden to eat the fruit of THE LAW, because the LAW SAYS "THERE IS NONE THAT DOETH RIGHTEOUSNESS, NO NOT ONE." And since we know that whatever the Law says, it says to those under the Law, it follows that all those under the Law (eating the fruit of it) are GUILTY BEFORE GOD, as well all those 'without the law', so that ALL THE WORLD MAY BECOME GUILTY BEFORE GOD.

And going even further, the Law was our SCHOOLMASTER TO BRING US TO CHRIST, because seeing that the Law declares ALL of us to be guilty before God, we see that God hath concluded ALL in unbelief, that He might have Mercy upon ALL.

Glory be to God.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

That's a large commandment, isn't it!

So, we know that we are not to speed, and yet I imagine we have all done that at some point... is that sin? How serious does God consider the sin of speeding (breaking the law of the land)?

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

That's a large commandment, isn't it!

So, we know that we are not to speed, and yet I imagine we have all done that at some point... is that sin? How serious does God consider the sin of speeding (breaking the law of the land)?

Not trying to make excuses, but when this passage was first brought to my attention when in high school, the implication was made just the way you seem to think in your reply.

Not the passage does not say, he that knows to do right to him it is sin. It says "good". I feel this goes to the greatest commandment, love God and your neighbor as yourself.

It is my personal feeling that we make too many things out to be sin, based on an implication. Paul deals with this issue I believe very well in Romans 14. Take for instance driving over the speed limit. We know we all do it at times, just because law dictates a speed limit does not make it a sin just because your driving down the road and happen to cross above the posted speed limit. But driving deliberately unsafely would in fact be wrong and it could be argued to be sin. Because now you are putting yourself and other in danger, thus NOT loving your neighbor as yourself.

Again in my opinion, those things we should be more concerned with are those things that fall under the command to love God and love your neighbor as yourself. Thus one would not commit adultery because that is against your neighbor, basically all the things Paul list as works of the flesh are counted as things that are against your neighbor.

Bottom line Jesus said when we fulfill "loving God and our neighbor as our self we fulfill the whole Law". Paul give a good balance of this in Romans 14, if we can grasp the elements of his teaching in this passage, we can lay to rest what is sin and what is not. Many things that are sin to one person are not to the next, and this is a principle we seem to forget.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Not trying to make excuses, but when this passage was first brought to my attention when in high school, the implication was made just the way you seem to think in your reply.

Not the passage does not say, he that knows to do right to him it is sin. It says "good". I feel this goes to the greatest commandment, love God and your neighbor as yourself.

It is my personal feeling that we make too many things out to be sin, based on an implication. Paul deals with this issue I believe very well in Romans 14. Take for instance driving over the speed limit. We know we all do it at times, just because law dictates a speed limit does not make it a sin just because your driving down the road and happen to cross above the posted speed limit. But driving deliberately unsafely would in fact be wrong and it could be argued to be sin. Because now you are putting yourself and other in danger, thus NOT loving your neighbor as yourself.

Again in my opinion, those things we should be more concerned with are those things that fall under the command to love God and love your neighbor as yourself. Thus one would not commit adultery because that is against your neighbor, basically all the things Paul list as works of the flesh are counted as things that are against your neighbor.

Bottom line Jesus said when we fulfill "loving God and our neighbor as our self we fulfill the whole Law". Paul give a good balance of this in Romans 14, if we can grasp the elements of his teaching in this passage, we can lay to rest what is sin and what is not. Many things that are sin to one person are not to the next, and this is a principle we seem to forget.

Very good... I was just trying to foster the discussion, and I see it as you do, although there are those who don't. Paul definitely taught that there can be a difference in what sin means from person to person, and one cannot make a universal law of sin based on a personal conviction.

I think where people get confused is labeling a personal conviction as "sin" in their lives, and then wanting to apply it to everyone else as a sin as well. This is where the "sin" thing can get complicated.

Just a silly example - if it is "sin" (or personal conviction) for me to wear red that is fine, but if I start preaching that everyone who wears the color red is sinning... then, that is where the waters get muddied. I'm sure we have all seen this happen, (I personally have known those who have preached against the color red, it being a sin to wear it, laying their personal conviction on their congregation and ).

We must be careful in what we label sin.... is it a universal sin that if all commit it have sinned, or is it a personal conviction that we have labeled sin in our own lives but may not be sin in another's life.

[Godsdrummer]

As has become my practice in the last 5 years, I looked up a passage in the NT and OT with the word "sin" to check the definition. Now I don't know I others will see this from my perspective, many don't. But the word sin in Greek means offense.
In Hebrew there are at least three words translated sin, that I have found on a quick look. They mean, to miss, guiltiness, and offense.
The thing is I think we make more of the word sin based on our way of thinking.

[Godsdrummer]

This chapter was driven home to me a few years ago while I did a in depth study on the chapter. During my first position as an ass. pastor, the pastor brought my attention to the last verse.

Rom 14:22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
He was very conservative at the time, but also a deep thinker. I don't know if he has followed much the same path as I have, but I imagine he must have to some degree.

What many dislike is Paul's opening statement "the weak brother or sister needs more rules to keep themselves right with God".

Rom 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
Rom 14:2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

Note the one that is weak is the one that is likely to be judgmental. Yet the one that is strong in faith, is more likely to despise the weak Christian. And do we not see this in churches today?

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Esaias

I believe that is correct.

Thanks. I wanted to see if someone else had found anything different.

Originally Posted by Esaias

Sin is transgression of the law. Therefore whatever is a transgression of the law of God is sin. Dishonouring your parents is sin. Stealing is sin. Adultery is sin. Why? Because those things are violations of the law of God (transgressions).

I thought it was interesting that sin is talked about all through the scriptures, but 1 John is the only place where sin is actually defined, and detailed. Jesus spoke about sin all the time, but He never defined it. I find that interesting.

Originally Posted by Esaias

But sin is defined Biblically as trangression of the law. The law defines and identifies sin:

Rom_7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Sin was in the world until Moses, but it was not imputed when there was no law. So... what happened to people before Moses who sinned?

Romans 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

What does Paul mean by the sin was not imputed when there is no law? It seems that he is implying here that there was no law from Adam until Moses.

Originally Posted by Esaias

As for 'the devil', the word devil means 'accuser'. It is a term that is taken from the concept of satan being one who accuses the people of God of their sins (see Job, etc). So the 'devil' is generally a NT term for 'satan', which is a Hebrew word for 'adversary' or 'enemy'. So then the 'devil' is the Adversary, that is, one who is opposed to God, his dominion (law), his grace, his divine Plan, etc. The devil 'sins from the beginning', that is, the enemy of God is in transgression, and is from the beginning. One who sins, ie one who transgresses God's law, is 'of the devil', much as Christ said to the Pharisees 'You are of your father the devil'. Being a 'child of' someone is a Hebrew figure of speech (a Hebraism) meaning one is partaking of the characteristic of someone, as if they were biologically descended from that someone. So the sinner is one who follows in the devil's footsteps, and bears the likeness of the devil - the enemy or opposer of God.

Thus, sin is the opposing of God and His ways, which are revealed in the law as explained and understood by the gospel.

Yes, I agree with this.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Thanks. I wanted to see if someone else had found anything different.




I thought it was interesting that sin is talked about all through the scriptures, but 1 John is the only place where sin is actually defined, and detailed. Jesus spoke about sin all the time, but He never defined it. I find that interesting.

Everyone understood that 'sin' meant transgression against God's law. It would be like if we talk about 'crime', would we need to always be saying 'now crime is the violation of the law'? We would have learned that as children.

Sin was in the world until Moses, but it was not imputed when there was no law. So... what happened to people before Moses who sinned?

Romans 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

What does Paul mean by the sin was not imputed when there is no law? It seems that he is implying here that there was no law from Adam until Moses.

He does not say there was no law. In fact he specifically says those before Moses 'sinned'. Thus, there HAD to be law before Moses. Not the law COVENANT, but the laws of God. Consider this about Abraham:

Gen_26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Abraham knew and kept God's commandments, statutes, and laws.