Help! Tormented dreams

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Brother, she confirmed to me in PM several things no one knew because they weren't on the thread. She didn't have to PM me. She could have simply said that she didn't think it was a spiritual attack, and I'd stand corrected. Only after you guys stayed in the canal mind to attack the notion of her even possibly being under a spiritual attack did she voice that she was now confused. God isn't the author of confusion.

Chris, are Christians attacked in their sleep by demons?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Finally, about "atmosphere".

Yeah, I've heard that buzzword half a dozen million times in Pentecost. And yeah, I know what people mean when they use it to sound spiritual. But it's pseudo-spiritual garbage. It has no clear definition and doesn't carry any Biblical weight behind it at all. It's meaningless, no matter how one slices it.

Less than a couple of weeks ago in one of my church's meetings, as we were singing and worshipping the Lord in my mom's living room, God gave me the word "atmosphere", and the verse in Isaiah 6 about the train of God's robe filling the temple, coupled with the NT concept of believers being the temple of God through the Holy Spirit.

I didn't fully understand it at the time, and considered sharing it, but decided against it, as I could tell the direction the Lord was leading didn't include sharing this word.

But then, this thread shows up, and the word "atmosphere" gets bandied about several times like it has potent Scriptural force to mean something important. Then I knew why the Lord talked to me about atmosphere.

It is simply uncanny the way the Lord works. His understanding is infinite.

So, when I see people talk about the Lord's presence, that it has to be invited in, that we have to create an atmosphere of praise and worship and whatever else, so the Lord will feel welcomed and become willing to respond to our prayers and petitions, I know it's a bunch of nonsense. God is already there, whether you feel or know it or not. He is Sovereign Creator and Sustainer of the Universe. We don't invite and welcome Him anywhere, He invites and welcomes us into His presence. Further, He goes where He wants when He wants. We are simply graced with His abiding presence through the Gospel. He is a loving Father, more than always willing to hear us and respond to us and answer us in prayer and petition.

We don't need to jump through hoops (like the prophets of Baal) to get God to come around and inhabit the "atmosphere" we create for Him so He can do the stuff we want Him to do. Rather, we need to enter into His gates with thanksgiving and into His courts with praise. The atmosphere, if you will, is already holy, powerful, full of love and mercy and grace, without our help. We just need to go in boldly as the author of Hebrews indicates.

I see what you're saying, it would have been best if they choose a different word than atmosphere. Because it's more about putting on the mind of Christ and getting our focus on Jesus than it is the atmosphere in a room or location. This misunderstanding had caused a lot of confusion as churches have tried to hype the congregation into a spiritual frenzy using carnal means.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

But how long are we to continuing oopsing?

We are still human?

Everyone needs to consider this phrase.

It is another way to say you are incapable of doing things that would be considered correct. People do beastial things and claim it is humanity creeping through. Since when is being human being somehow contributed to flaws? Since one of the fundamental tenets of Calvinism is the inherent sinfulness of man. Calvin’s doctrine of total depravity is the belief that we are born in such a state that we are totally corrupt, inherently sinful, and unable to do what is right on our own. The doctrine states that one cannot even come to God without a direct operation of the Holy Ghost upon their heart. This doctrine is the most prevalent teaching within our culture since the first Puritan set foot on these shores. Our culture is bathed in it, mingled with the American Indian's nature cult. Rag'n'Bone Man's song "only human after all" paints this picture perfectly. That we aren't to be blamed for anything we do, because we are only human after all. Sorry, but that isn't what the Gospel teaches. We aren't supposed to remain the beast, we are to be converted to a different nature. The lion who once totally lived on flesh, is changed to eat straw. Proverbs 26:3 explains that whips, and bridles are only for animals. Meaning that animals must be forced to obey, as so do fools. But fools are said to not believe in God. Not that there isn't a God, but they don't trust Him to be correct and the only way. Cain offered a sacrifice out of religious duty, and his brother out of devotional love. We see this throughout the whole Bible. Tares look just like the wheat, and therefore they are only harvested at the time of maturity. That is why Paul spoke of a time when we should have come to full maturity, but hadn't because we never get past even the basic principles of Christ.

Are we only human after all?

Therefore we aren't too be blamed?

Sorry, but that don't cut it with Christ.

You're running with it. Lol

I didn't review and confirm the list. Votive didn't review and confirm that his accusation was confirmed in the post he referenced. My goal was to help a sister. Votive, his goal was to slander a member of the forum.

Who is being a beast?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Continued...



I'll step back and reconsider. But try to understand me. I'm not coming at this from a purely theoretical position that is only on paper. I've either been there or done that. It's an experience. I can't deny what I've personally seen and know.

And to the charge that I'm the expert on everything. I'm not. I get eaten alive on the eschatology threads. LOL I'd like to submit a possibility for you to consider as I step back and reconsider things. Is it possible that I primarily respond to things or post about things that I am rather familiar with? And as a result, I sound like a know it all? I mean, I can pretend I've never seen or experienced the things we talk about, but that would be a lie to join this "club" of sorts that seems to attack me from all directions. It wouldn't be honest. It wouldn't be truth.

For example, have you ever been involved with fishing out evil spirit in a home? Sure, you've said prayers rebuking "bumps in the night" and the "spirit of anger" or "lust" or "addiction" in your own home and for a couple other people. But this is different. It's a "deliverance prayer meeting". You're told that it might go on all night "if necessary". You have several brothers from a couple different churches who showed up with pop, tea, coffee, chips, and sandwiches. They greet each other and laugh and chit-chat like old friends, but this is your first time. You're introduced and they ask you if you've done this before and you say no. They look at each other and smile, "You're going to see the power of God, my brother.", they say to you. One quotes a Scripture, "The gates of Hell shell NOT PREVAIL.", in joyful voice. They others individually say, "Amen." One starts setting up snack trays, sandwiches, and drinks in the kitchen. You don't know what to expect. You feel like you're primarily an observer. The woman who lives in the home is divorced. She has her aunt (who says "Somethin' just isn't right in this house.") is at the house with her. Her kids are at her mom's. You're thinking, "Wow, they must take this kinda seriously to evacuate the kids." There's a box of a couple things the lady of the house had boxed up to be thrown out. All you see in the box is a few CDs, what looks like a paperback book or two, a roach clip, and the side of a dream catcher. Two brothers take it outside and dump the stuff into the garbage. Matt calls the group into the living room and introduces everyone. He explains that the goal is to "confirm and cast out" any evil spirit in the home. He shares that Rachel, the woman who lives there, has experienced: anxiety, nightmares, mood swings, had thoughts of suicide, and feels like she's being watched. She's afraid for her children. He shares that she occasionally hears something call her name, but nothing is there. She also states that she's heard something moving around, like walking or crawling on occasion. So Matt opens in prayer, everyone prays. Some speak in tongues others do not. There is praise, worship, clapping, and a few whoots and "Hallelujahs". People are pleading the blood over one another, in the name of Jesus. Matt has everyone take a seat. Some are on the couch, some are seated on a love seat, and the rest are on some folding chairs. You're thinking they must be from a church, they have that white plastic seat and back to them. Matt opens his Bible and starts reading in Mark 16:15-18, and then he re-reads verse 17 where it says, "And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils." Matt begins teaching on what evil spirits are (fallen angels) and offers some of the traditional verses to support that conclusion. He begins talking about Jesus and how many times he cast out an evil spirit in the Gospels. He gets into the church and the book of Acts where it describes devils being cast out. He reiterates, "The Gates of Hell shall not prevail against the church." After the Bible study which lasts maybe 30 to 40 minutes, Matt closes the meeting with prayer and opportunity for repentance and the confession of sin, he talks about how the devil is a liar and is already trying to discourage people from casting out devils by making them feel unworthy and throwing their back into their faces. Matt then requests that we thank God for the victory ahead of time and then he speaks straight to any spiritual presence that isn't of God, telling it that it's days are numbered and that tonight will be the last night it will be in the house. Everyone praises and worships one last time. He then explains that we are going to have a deliverance prayer meeting. He asks that the lights be softened and that some praise and worship music be played on the living room stereo. Everyone gets up and begins walking around the house, in different directions, praising Jesus and praying for others and reminding any spirit in the home that it is already defeated. Rachel is praying and crying. Now, some time has passed. Rachel and her aunt are in the living room watching television and yawning. A couple brothers are walking the yard in prayer. You and Matt are in the dining room praying, rocking back and forth on chairs, another brother is in the kitchen praying. You're feeling board. And you're wondering why all the worship and praise just to fish this thing out...when you could have already said a prayer and gone out to eat? How did you feel when suddenly things get real strange... like a weird silence and a strange lull falls over the group... the lights flicker, and the two dogs that were in secured in the laundry room suddenly break into a dog-fight-to-the-death, with snarling, growling, and yelping. Rachel and her aunt get up to split the dogs up and that's when Matt says it, "There it is. Here we go..." and without warning he begins pleading the blood and commanding it out in the name of Jesus. A couple other brothers are praying similarly and are worshipping in the middle of Matts prayers. There are a few whoots, a shout, and people start clapping harder, Matt encourages everyone to keep worshipping, saying, "I rebuke you in Jesus name, I cast you out, you have no authority in this place!" A couple people stomp and shout rebuking the enemy in their own words, something breaks and soon there is this sense of peace and people start crying. Matt is in the living room praying with Rachel and her aunt while holding the dogs. Rachel is crying as Matt prays with her telling her it's gone and is affirming her identity in Christ. There are some more shouts of praise and worship, only now people are thanking Jesus for removing the spirit. Matt is walking the house and pleading the blood with Rachel in every room to insulate it from the enemy. He's fired up. Things die down and a couple brothers help clean up the kitchen. Everyone is happy and talking about how good God is as people start putting on their coats and gathering their things to leave. People walk by Rachel and affirm that she's going to be blessed now that the thing is gone. You walk out to your car and Matt waves before getting into his car. He rolls down the window and says, "Hey! Call me tomorrow, I know it's late. I want to know if you had any questions about what happened here tonight." You agree to call him the next day and then you look at your watch. It's after 3am. You get into your Jeep Liberty and drive home pondering the events of the evening.

Can you just sit that experience, and experiences like, them aside and think, none of that is real...but some criticism from a stranger on the internet is?

What is this?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You're running with it. Lol

I didn't review and confirm the list. Votive didn't review and confirm that his accusation was confirmed in the post he referenced. My goal was to help a sister. Votive, his goal was to slander a member of the forum.

Who is being a beast?

Aquila I have a PM that you sent me that I need to return to you.

I want you to explain it to me in the light of this thread.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Chris, do you know what a dibbūq is?

Not really. I remember hearing that in Judaism, some Jew's believe that a demon spirit or ghost can often possess people and that sometimes these spirits are cast out and imprisoned in objects, an animal, or a personal item to keep them under control. It's just Jewish lore, but It reminded me of how Jesus cast the legion of devils out of a man and put them into a heard of swine.

I don't know much about it beyond that.

[jediwill83]

spacing and paragraph indentation is a thing. it would really help those of us holding a bucket of popcorn in one hand and our phones in the other be able to keep up with the flow of writing much better.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Not really. I remember hearing that in Judaism, some Jew's believe that a demon spirit or ghost can often possess people and that sometimes these spirits are cast out and imprisoned in objects, an animal, or a personal item to keep them under control. It's just Jewish lore, but It reminded me of how Jesus cast the legion of devils out of a man and put them into a heard of swine.

I don't know much about it beyond that.

Do you believe that Jesus removed demons and placed them into something else?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Not really. I remember hearing that in Judaism, some Jew's believe that a demon spirit or ghost can often possess people and that sometimes these spirits are cast out and imprisoned in objects, an animal, or a personal item to keep them under control. It's just Jewish lore, but It reminded me of how Jesus cast the legion of devils out of a man and put them into a heard of swine.

I don't know much about it beyond that.

Now, with the doll, how did dibbūq come up in the story?

[Esaias]

Some people cannot accept the idea they are wrong.

This is my last post on this thread. Aquila, you have no gift of discernment, you have no discernment whatsoever. You are a liberal democrat, you support the party of baby butchering, you have publicly called for protests and vandalism of churches, you even said if someone went postal and shot up a church you'd "understand", you are a socialist, you dabble with psychic readings, you practice clairvoyancy and psychometry, voodoo nonsense.

You are the LAST person on God's earth who should be "helping" anyone with ANY "spiritual concern". You are utterly blind to your situation, you are under the control of something and it isn't holy.

You have been warned FOR YEARS by numerous people who have backgrounds in the mire you've gotten yourself stuck in, but still you won't listen.

Wise in your own conceits, doing psychic readings via pm on an internet forum, good God in Zion you need Jesus like you don't even realize!

Just remember, people tried to help you out, but you refuse to listen. I won't bother reading any reply from you, nor will you be bothered with any more posts from me.

But you SERIOUSLY need SERIOUS help.