Why Sunday

[Esaias]

What is "morality"? What is "moral law"?

Morality is doing what you ought to do.

Moral law is the law that governs moral agents. It is the obligations they have. It is "what people ought to do."

If people ought to keep the Sabbath, it is moral law. Period. It's oughtness is what makes it moral.

Morality or moral character is the condition of the person in regard to their fulfilling or failing to fulfill their duty, what they ought to do. It is immoral to disobey God because obedience to God consists in doing what God wants us to do. What God wants us to do is called "moral law", a code of conduct.

Saying that the Sabbath contains no spiritual benefit is in my opinion an indication of a very low regard for something God blessed, hallowed, sanctified, and gave to man as a gift.

God wants to His people call the Sabbath a delight, and offers a promise:

Isaiah 58:13-14 KJV
If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord , honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: [14] Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord ; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it .

If a person doesn't have that attitude towards the things of God, well, I guess they just don't. I don't understand why a Christian wouldn't think of the Sabbath as a delight, and honourable, that is, a REALLY GOOD THING.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What is "morality"? What is "moral law"?

Morality is doing what you ought to do.

Moral law is the law that governs moral agents. It is the obligations they have. It is "what people ought to do."

If people ought to keep the Sabbath, it is moral law. Period. It's oughtness is what makes it moral.

Morality or moral character is the condition of the person in regard to their fulfilling or failing to fulfill their duty, what they ought to do. It is immoral to disobey God because obedience to God consists in doing what God wants us to do. What God wants us to do is called "moral law", a code of conduct.

Saying that the Sabbath contains no spiritual benefit is in my opinion an indication of a very low regard for something God blessed, hallowed, sanctified, and gave to man as a gift.

God wants to His people call the Sabbath a delight, and offers a promise:

Isaiah 58:13-14 KJV
If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord , honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: [14] Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord ; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it .

If a person doesn't have that attitude towards the things of God, well, I guess they just don't. I don't understand why a Christian wouldn't think of the Sabbath as a delight, and honourable, that is, a REALLY GOOD THING.

People were told that they ought to engage in diverse washings and carnal ordinances. It was moral for them to do that. People were told to construct a physical temple in Jerusalem. That was a moral thing to do as a result, because it's moral to bey anything God says. But what God says, so far as shadows are concerned, changes into speaking about the body of truths that casts those shadows.

It was moral to offer animals in sacrifice. But since covenants CHANGED, the moral thing to now do is move with the covenants and not attend a physical temple in Jerusalem, but be part of the New Jerusalem, the church. The moral thing to do is to not offer animals, but to recognize the sacrifice of Jesus as the body of those animal-sacrificial-= shadows

Try as you might, you cannot put sabbath in with morality when it was distinctly called a shadow when nothing moral was a shadow of anything. Show me where refusing to murder is a shadow!

If you grow a garden, do you let is rest every seven years and see God multiply the growth of the sixth year to last the seventh and eight afterward? Show me one farmer or gardener who does this and sees those results int he new covenant. Or are they shadows? Seventh day sabbath and seventh year sabbath are in the same book!

[mfblume]

Well, seems like you have a bunch of converts to sabbatarianism. I'd like to see testimonies of the claims of everyone who has come to agree with you posted here for us to read! Who will start cooking all their food on Friday for the sabbath from now on? Can I get a witness?

As for me and my house we keep the body, and not the shadow.

I say this not in mockery, for I really am interested in seeing people publicize this change of doctrine for them.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Well, seems like you have a bunch of converts to sabbatarianism. I'd like to see testimonies of the claims of everyone who has come to agree with you posted here for us to read! Who will start cooking all their food on Friday for the sabbath from now on? Can I get a witness?

As for me and my house we keep the body, and not the shadow.

I say this not in mockery, for I really am interested in seeing people publicize this change of doctrine for them.

Lol! All I am doing is trying to give a reasoned defense of what I believe is the sound doctrine of the apostolic faith and practice.

Not in mockery? Sounds like a wee bit of mockery in there, to be honest.

It also sounds like you are judging people for obeying the 4th commandment? Doesn't your own position prohibit that?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Lol! All I am doing is trying to give a reasoned defense of what I believe is the sound doctrine of the apostolic faith and practice.

Not in mockery? Sounds like a wee bit of mockery in there, to be honest.

It also sounds like you are judging people for obeying the 4th commandment? Doesn't your own position prohibit that?

I am not judging. How can I be judging when I say what Paul said? God already judged the issue. I just added thoughts that sabbath keepers have to realize if they are to engage in it as you propose we should. Paul said it's weakness of faith, not me.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I am not judging. How can I be judging when I say what Paul said? God already judged the issue. I just added thoughts that sabbath keepers have to realize if they are to engage in it as you propose we should. Paul said it's weakness of faith, not me.

Your comment about you and your house keeping the body and not the shadow comes across as you viewing sabbath keepers as less spiritual than yourself. I am not offended, believe me. I don't get upset if someone tells me I am out of the will of God, I just ask for proof and evidence, because I want to be in the will of God.

Sabbath keeping involves doing and not doing certain things that non Sabbath keepers aren't accustomed to. Like not doing chores on that day. It always amuses me when people think Sabbath keeping involves doing a bunch of extra hard work ("bondage!!") or something. It's the opposite, in fact. It's a day of REST, not extra hard slave labour lol.

Preparing for the Sabbath is part of it. It isn't hard to make food in advance (don't people often do that anyway?) nor is it hard to not mow the lawn or go shopping. Well, maybe for some that would be hard.

When we first began obeying the 4th commandment way way back when, it was strange and difficult at first. Because it was so different from what we were used to and how we were raised. But learning, studying God's word, praying, allowing the Holy Ghost to lead and guide, results in a progression and change of a person's whole life and lifestyle. Looking back I see just how chaotic and disorganised my life was before I allowed God to manage my time.

I am certainly not saying Sabbath keeping cures all ills. Anymore than any other Bible commandment. But like with all things God says to do, there are benefits to just trusting and obeying God.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Your comment about you and your house keeping the body and not the shadow comes across as you viewing sabbath keepers as less spiritual than yourself. I am not offended, believe me. I don't get upset if someone tells me I am out of the will of God, I just ask for proof and evidence, because I want to be in the will of God.

Fair enough. But being strong or weak in faith is a reality, and I do believe ther eis weakness of faith in sabbath keeper on that issue when compared to those who claim otherwise. You obviously believe you are more advanced in this issue than I am, or you would not disagree with my stance, on thie issue. But I do claim that's what Paul spoke about by describing those weak in faith, for that is the context, and it's nothing personal. Neither is it anything to brag about, for Paul stated that the more he learned about what was true, the more he realized that he knew nothing. For God to speak to someone about an issue is nothing to boast about. While the legalist is warned to not judge, the enlightened are warned to not despise.

Sabbath keeping involves doing and not doing certain things that non Sabbath keepers aren't accustomed to. Like not doing chores on that day. It always amuses me when people think Sabbath keeping involves doing a bunch of extra hard work ("bondage!!") or something. It's the opposite, in fact. It's a day of REST, not extra hard slave labour lol.

It's not doing, and Paul addressed that in Colossians 2 as part of the touch not, taste not handle not ordinances of the elements of the world, which I know you claim are not what Paul meant by elements of the world.

Preparing for the Sabbath is part of it. It isn't hard to make food in advance (don't people often do that anyway?) nor is it hard to not mow the lawn or go shopping. Well, maybe for some that would be hard.

As I said, someone I know honestly and sincerely set out to do that with twice of much work on a Friday as any other day, so that Saturday's food was all prepared. And it is more work on the sixth. It just is. You work twice as much on the sixth day to do none of the seventh, so far as food is concerned, and other things that must be done before the
seventh day arrives when it cannot be done. Chores. etc. This person told me it was really wracking. They were not engaging in it to argue a point, but to honestly try it. And to think that all of that change and effort is necessary to keep the sabbath, shows quite an effort to change, let alone work twice as much on the sixth day.

When we first began obeying the 4th commandment way way back when, it was strange and difficult at first. Because it was so different from what we were used to and how we were raised. But learning, studying God's word, praying, allowing the Holy Ghost to lead and guide, results in a progression and change of a person's whole life and lifestyle. Looking back I see just how chaotic and disorganised my life was before I allowed God to manage my time.

I am certainly not saying Sabbath keeping cures all ills. Anymore than any other Bible commandment. But like with all things God says to do, there are benefits to just trusting and obeying God.

..if you are right in saying sabbath day is not fulfilled with a spiritual rest instead of the shadow.

But go for it! If that's what you see in the word, do so. I disagree with you on this in very strong terms. But we are not serving each other. We serve God. Blessings!