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View Poll Results: Do You Believe That God Is For The Death Penalty Under the NT Covenant?
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I believe that He is for the death penalty
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10 |
47.62% |
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I believe that He is for the death penalty and stoning people for adultery
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0% |
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I do not believe that God is for the death penalty under the NT Covenant.
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11 |
52.38% |
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I believe that God is for an eye for an eye.
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0% |
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09-25-2007, 04:33 PM
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Still Figuring It Out.
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
So should the church carry out public stonings? Or does the church wait for the powers that be (goverment law) to kill the offenders for them?
Where are the scriptures in the NT that allow for death penalty?
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That is actually my current question.
I have been for the death penalty in the past but I am increasingly having trouble reconciling that thought with the NT message.
I have no scriptures to offer in answer to your question. I share your question.
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09-25-2007, 04:49 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 41,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth
That is actually my current question.
I have been for the death penalty in the past but I am increasingly having trouble reconciling that thought with the NT message.
I have no scriptures to offer in answer to your question. I share your question.
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I think that using deadly force as self defense to be against the NT teachings so I would be also against having the state or government kill anyone for me. Vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord, so if that were the case it would be up to God to exact judgement. God used Gentile armies to bring judgement against His enemies, so would you say that God uses a non-Christian group to carry out His judgements? The Jews used political pull to cause Pontius Pilate to put to death Jesus after Pontius Pilate was convinced that Jesus was innocent. Death penalty can also be used to kill the innocent when used by a corrupt system.
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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09-25-2007, 04:55 PM
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Still Figuring It Out.
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
God used Gentile armies to bring judgement against His enemies, so would you say that God uses a non-Christian group to carry out His judgements?
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I think when death penalties are carried out by governments that these are the judgments of man upon man for a man's wrongs.
God's judgments upon us are eternal ones.
A murderer could find forgiveness and turn his life over to God and escape God's judgment even if man continued with his judgment and executed the individual.
The repentant thief demonstrated this to us on some level.
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09-25-2007, 08:54 PM
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uncharismatic conservative maverick
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth
I think when death penalties are carried out by governments that these are the judgments of man upon man for a man's wrongs.
God's judgments upon us are eternal ones.
A murderer could find forgiveness and turn his life over to God and escape God's judgment even if man continued with his judgment and executed the individual.
The repentant thief demonstrated this to us on some level.
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The repentant thief was not a murderer. So I fail to see your point.
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09-26-2007, 09:14 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 41,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
The repentant thief was not a murderer. So I fail to see your point.
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Sin is sin, there are no levels to sin. Man places a level to sin, but God just calls all sin wicked. Brother Eastman, if the thief never repented, would he have been anymore less lost than a murderer?
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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09-27-2007, 08:28 AM
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uncharismatic conservative maverick
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
Sin is sin, there are no levels to sin. Man places a level to sin, but God just calls all sin wicked. Brother Eastman, if the thief never repented, would he have been anymore less lost than a murderer?
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What is your point? I beleive in the death penalty for those that take someone elses life (this is what the argument is about for me) The thief paid a penalty for death in a system that was in another era. ?????????
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09-27-2007, 03:07 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 41,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman
What is your point? I beleive in the death penalty for those that take someone elses life (this is what the argument is about for me) The thief paid a penalty for death in a system that was in another era. ?????????
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Did Christians execute the thief? The point is this Brother Eastman; those who are filled with the Spirit of God do not exact revenge, or bring judgement by deadly force on anyone. Therefore if those who are of a government (namely Roman Empire crucifixion capital punishment) would be bringing the punishment NOT the Apostolic Jesus name people.
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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09-25-2007, 09:52 PM
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Unvaxxed Pureblood too
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 41,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth
I think when death penalties are carried out by governments that these are the judgments of man upon man for a man's wrongs.
God's judgments upon us are eternal ones.
A murderer could find forgiveness and turn his life over to God and escape God's judgment even if man continued with his judgment and executed the individual.
The repentant thief demonstrated this to us on some level.
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I totally agree with you, and what happens when those who have committed crimes are punished they are under the mercy of the Lord, and it is up to God whether they obtain mercy or judgement. Man's judgements are harsh, and unforgiving, while God is love and full of mercy. The Lord's will is that all would turn to Him in repentence and that none would perish.
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
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09-25-2007, 05:20 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 5,529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
I think that using deadly force as self defense to be against the NT teachings so I would be also against having the state or government kill anyone for me. Vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord, so if that were the case it would be up to God to exact judgement. God used Gentile armies to bring judgement against His enemies, so would you say that God uses a non-Christian group to carry out His judgements? The Jews used political pull to cause Pontius Pilate to put to death Jesus after Pontius Pilate was convinced that Jesus was innocent. Death penalty can also be used to kill the innocent when used by a corrupt system.
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Paul plainly states that God sets up Rulers as revengers to execute judgement on those that are evil. Was Paul going contradicting God?
__________________
Psa 119:165 (KJV) 165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.
"Do not believe everthing you read on the internet" - Abe Lincoln
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09-25-2007, 05:33 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 8,102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RevDWW
Paul plainly states that God sets up Rulers as revengers to execute judgement on those that are evil. Was Paul going contradicting God?
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I think the church is different than civil government. Roman government was nothing close to a democracy. The church was powerless to halt any execution, and in fact willingly laid their own lives on the line because of their beliefs.
Was the Roman government God-ordained? Was Paul, aka Saul, justified in his evil treatment of Christians? Were the Christians worthy of death simply because an evil government chose to execute them?
Nowhere in the NT does the church assert a right to kill those who are evil. No, the church chose a different method of dealing with the wicked - they converted them.
Maybe instead of trying to enforce morality through legislation, we should actually live godly, mercifully, and be witnesses to the godless.
Killing people seals their eternal damnation.
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