Do you hafta go through the pastor?

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

You are mixing definitions.

Obeying them that have the rule doesn't make a ruler in the sense you are describing--an extreme absolute monarch.

The Bibilical "rule" must be defined Biblically--it speaks of servant leadership that saints voluntarily submit to, with the condition that the leader is following Christ.

You are taking the phrase, defining it in a way the Scripture does not, and then speaking against that.

I think that fits the description oflogical fallacy.

and here I thought it was just about what I was being asked for when prompted repeatedly for "what part of OBEY them that have the RULE over you, don't you understand?"

If you can uncouple OBEY and RULER, more power to ya.

btw, CS,
please don't let this "re-re-re-fryed" topic toss a blanket on any of the excitement of being in Tampa. You and LCS just enjoy yourself, Lord willing, we'll be hear when you get back.

[Coonskinner]

Originally Posted by tbpew

and here I thought it was just about what I was being asked for when prompted repeatedly for "what part of OBEY them that have the RULE over you, don't you understand?"

If you can uncouple OBEY and RULER, more power to ya.

btw, CS,
please don't let this "re-re-re-fryed" topic toss a blanket on any of the excitement of being in Tampa. You and LCS just enjoy yourself, Lord willing, we'll be hear when you get back.

Frankly, I don't care for large cities.

I am here for two reasons--to participate in the business of the God themed man club I belong to....

And because my wife likes to come.

And the Bible is where we got the terms "obey" and "rule."

That doesn't mean mindless obedience to just anybody.

There are qualifications.

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

Frankly, I don't care for large cities.

I am here for two reasons--to participate in the business of the God themed man club I belong to....

And because my wife likes to come.

And the Bible is where we got the terms "obey" and "rule."

That doesn't mean mindless obedience to just anybody.

There are qualifications.

CS, why not just do this....
walk up to the person who has RULE over you and OBEY whatever they tell you to do!

Then just rest in knowing you have done all the God expects you to do.

[Coonskinner]

Originally Posted by tbpew

CS, why not just do this....
walk up to the person who has RULE over you and OBEY whatever they tell you to do!

Then just rest in knowing you have done all the God expects you to do.

I am having supper with my pastor tonight.

I do what he tells meto do.

The deal is, he respects me and my walk with God, and basically offers guidance when he feels it is needful.

If for whatever reason he felt to give me some strong admonition, I would receive it and obey him, unless he told me to do something that was unscriptural.

But I trust him and know him well enough to know that he won't do that.

I'm with Barb, this is being overcomplicated.

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

I am having supper with my pastor tonight.

I do what he tells meto do.

The deal is, he respects me and my walk with God, and basically offers guidance when he feels it is needful.

If for whatever reason he felt to give me some strong admonition, I would receive it and obey him, unless he told me to do something that was unscriptural.

But I trust him and know him well enough to know that he won't do that.

I'm with Barb, this is being overcomplicated.

I understand that if you believe that ONE guy who you acknowledge as your pastor tells you you need to move from where you are, you need to move. Afterall, that's what obedience is all about!

No body has to OBEY their guides. They need to thoughtfully and soberly consider the qualifications of their guides and the witness of their guide's counsels.

But following is all about free choice when it comes to a guide.

Not following a ruler is all about rebellion.

[Coonskinner]

Originally Posted by tbpew

I understand that if you believe that ONE guy who you acknowledge as your pastor tells you you need to move from where you are, you need to move. Afterall, that's what obedience is all about!

No body has to OBEY their guides. They need to thoughtfully and soberly consider the qualifications of their guides and the witness of their guide's counsels.

But following is all about free choice when it comes to a guide.

Not following a ruler is all about rebellion.

There you go with "ruler" again.

[Barb]

Okay, Bro. Pew...here's a question...

We have been quoting the first part of this Scripture...

Heb 13:17

17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves:

What say ye of the rest of this verse?!

for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
KJV