The Reason Some Apostolics Are Concerned: The Results of Erased Lines

[bdlooney]

AB,
I am not trying to pick a fight but I have a question.

Are you saying it is better to believe something (i.e. the Trinity) and not really know why rather than knowing what you believe and why you believe it (i.e. Oneness)?

Isn't saying that attempting control in beliefs? Saying, " Here this doctrine is true but I really don't know why cause I don't understand it either but it is incomprehensible and just go on faith."

Personally, I would like to know exactly in whom I have believed and why I believe it.

If I have misunderstood please inform me so.

[ThePastorsCoach]

Originally Posted by bdlooney

AB,
I am not trying to pick a fight but I have a question.

Are you saying it is better to believe something (i.e. the Trinity) and not really know why rather than knowing what you believe and why you believe it (i.e. Oneness)?
ANSWER - NO - I just wanted some to know this info - Some only think within their sphere of reasoning that others do it like they do it - does that make ANY sense? LOL I think it is GREAT that you believe what you do and stand for it - I just don't believe you should condemn everybody else because the don't see it like you see it. There is RARE consensus among "Apostolic" brethren - they simply do not see eye to eye on MOST things - except that - they believe in the Hall/Bernard version of the "Oneness" doctrine and they baptize in Jesus name and you must be filled with the Holy Ghost and speak in tongues to be saved. Outside of that - as you know - it gets crazy!!!!!!!!!!!!

Isn't saying that attempting control in beliefs? Saying, " Here this doctrine is true but I really don't know why cause I don't understand it either but it is incomprehensible and just go on faith."
ANSWER - NO, I did not say I agree with it - just simply stating facts for some to know this is the way they believe. They do not CONCENTRATE or elaborate on doctrine.

Personally, I would like to know exactly in whom I have believed and why I believe it.
SO Very True - I concur!

If I have misunderstood please inform me so.

I think you misunderstood me - I was not defending the TRINITY! I was simply stating that is the way they are. Some on here think that if they go to a "Trinity" Church - they will hear about the Trinity and baptism in the F/S/HG and that is simply NOT TRUE. They are not out to RE-CONVERT YOU.

[Sandra]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

I think you misunderstood me - I was not defending the TRINITY! I was simply stating that is the way they are. Some on here think that if they go to a "Trinity" Church - they will hear about the Trinity and baptism in the F/S/HG and that is simply NOT TRUE. They are not out to RE-CONVERT YOU.

Thanks AB you are soooo right.

[Steve Epley]

Because doctrine means ZIP to most. Whereas doctrine is primary in Apostolic churches.

[Whole Hearted]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Because doctrine means ZIP to most. Whereas doctrine is primary in Apostolic churches.

[ThePastorsCoach]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Because doctrine means ZIP to most. Whereas doctrine is primary in Apostolic churches.

This is true Elder - It is not the primary focus.
I know you will strongly disagree with me - but I don't believe it was the focus of Jesus or the Apostolic First century church either. The church should be about MINISTRY. I understand completely that you believe it should be about doctrine - I have been there and done that and Lost my T-Shirt doing it - I am NOT going that route again!

These people I pastor - could care less how I baptize them! They just appreciate someone that provides;
1. A Safe Physical and Spiritual atmosphere for them and their family.
2. That they gain insight and a fresh perspective in the Word of God.
3. That RELEVANT issues are dealt with and explained and they are given a spiritual perspective on RELEVANT issues.
4. That they are challenged to be better than they are. That they can progress from where they are - Spiritually.
5. That someone relates to their problems and needs and can help them through them.

People need MINISTRY! They are hurting and abused and battered all week in our humanistic society and they need HOPE, HEALING and HELP. That is what we provide. They WANT to be good Christians and to follow Jesus Christ. This is their desire. When we provide a place of ministry and give them Fresh Bread from heaven - they will jump in the water to be baptized anyway you want to baptize them.
Why is it so important to some - to have to tell them - YOU ARE GOING TO HELL IF YOU DON'T DO IT THIS WAY! YOU ARE WRONG - YOUR DEAD MOTHER IS IN HELL because she did not do what I am preaching!!!!!!!!!!!

You know - When I read about Shepherds - they LEAD sheep. I have been in a LOT of places - where I felt SO much worse after being there - cause they beat and slapped on us the whole time. WHO NEEDS THAT? Warped sheep!

[bdlooney]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop;289676
[B

These people I pastor - could care less how I baptize them! [/B]They just appreciate someone that provides;
1. A Safe Physical and Spiritual atmosphere for them and their family.
2. That they gain insight and a fresh perspective in the Word of God.
3. That RELEVANT issues are dealt with and explained and they are given a spiritual perspective on RELEVANT issues.
4. That they are challenged to be better than they are. That they can progress from where they are - Spiritually.
5. That someone relates to their problems and needs and can help them through them.

How can anyone care less how they are baptized? It does matter!! There is only One Baptism!

Answer me this: What are we reaching people with if they have ministry but not accurate doctrine?

It is merely a social gospel that will gain no one entrance to Beulah land. It doesn't matter how many hungry bellies we feed or how many backs we clothe if we have not gained access to the Father through the Lord Jesus Christ. Neither does it matter if you know doctrine forwards and backwards if you don't feed Him when He is hungry.

You must have Spirit and Truth! They are both a necessity in this Christian life.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by bdlooney

[COLOR="Blue"]How can anyone care less how they are baptized? It does matter!! There is only One Baptism!

]

Most people have not been told over and over and over again that if they are not baptized in thus and such precise way, they are going to hell. Most are just baptized in faith believing and wanting to express that faith.

[ThePastorsCoach]

Originally Posted by bdlooney

How can anyone care less how they are baptized? It does matter!! There is only One Baptism!

Answer me this: What are we reaching people with if they have ministry but not accurate doctrine?

It is merely a social gospel that will gain no one entrance to Beulah land. It doesn't matter how many hungry bellies we feed or how many backs we clothe if we have not gained access to the Father through the Lord Jesus Christ. Neither does it matter if you know doctrine forward and backward if you don't feed Him when He is hungry.

You must have Spirit and Truth! They are both a necessity in this Christian life.

HEY - Stop reading what I DID NOT SAY! I did NOT say "it does not matter"!!!!!!! I KNOW it matters - WHY do keep reading my post wrong! I did not say there was MORE THAN ONE BAPTISM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Try to read my post with a different mindset!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MAN - I was simply stating the facts of the matter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You obviously don't understand what I believe ministry is!!!!!!!!
I preach and teach that Jesus Christ is God in the Flesh.
The Revelation of Jesus Christ - God in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself.
I preach REPENTANCE!
I baptize in the name of Jesus Christ.
I preach and demonstrate the Baptism in the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues.
I teach living a life of holiness and separation from the world.

WHY CAN"T YOU ALL GET IT - that everybody that leaves you don't go to the dogs and throw away all the doctrine they have!!!!!!!!!!!!
Here - Doctrine is the foundation - Ministry is the walls and the roof.
I know that may be WAY too deep for some to comprehend!

[PastorDaniel]

Originally Posted by bdlooney

How can anyone care less how they are baptized? It does matter!! There is only One Baptism!

I see people on here using Ephesians 4:5 ...One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism...to refer to Jesus Name baptism all the time.

Explain this in the context of the following passage that relates to Spirit baptism....

Luke 3:16 (King James Version)
16John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

How is it that One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism specifically relates to Water Baptism and not Spirit Baptism?

Just curious?