UPC found in Wikipedia under "Schisms & Splits"

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Do we think the divine flesh issue rises to the level of ultimately being salvational?

Originally Posted by AGAPE

yes

Not to be argumentative, but I do have to wonder about that.

If they get baptized in Jesus name, and God fills them with his spirit are they not saved?
And if yes, does having a distorted view of the Godhead nullify their salvation experience?

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Not to be argumentative, but I do have to wonder about that.

If they get baptized in Jesus name, and God fills them with his spirit are they not saved?
And if yes, does having a distorted view of the Godhead nullify their salvation experience?

I think they teach another Jesus other then the one the Apostles taught.

[Apprehended]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I think they teach another Jesus other then the one the Apostles taught.

I've heard that. I'm not convinced. It seems to me that their perspective on the same Jesus is a bit skewed. But, if every oneness believer was lost because of a skewed understanding of the One God, Jesus, there would not be very many oneness believers saved.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Apprehended

I've heard that. I'm not convinced. It seems to me that their perspective on the same Jesus is a bit skewed. But, if every oneness believer was lost because of a skewed understanding of the One God, Jesus, there would not be very many oneness believers saved.

To teach Jesus had no biological tie with the human family is heresy not a difference of opinion. To have His flesh as some demi-god by creation instead of being the seed of the woman will lead to Twoness eventually but if it never does it is still heresy plain and simple. I think it borders on Gnosticism denounced by the Apostle John.

[Apprehended]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

To teach Jesus had no biological tie with the human family is heresy not a difference of opinion. To have His flesh as some demi-god by creation instead of being the seed of the woman will lead to Twoness eventually but if it never does it is still heresy plain and simple. I think it borders on Gnosticism denounced by the Apostle John.

Agreed...

However heresy for the sake of heresy alone will not condemn a person neccessarily, depending on the extent of the heresy.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Apprehended

Agreed...

However heresy for the sake of heresy alone will not condemn a person neccessarily, depending on the extent of the heresy.

This heresy makes him an antichrist.

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Teke's doctrine acutally denies Jesus has come in the flesh thus he is a anti-christ.

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

This heresy makes him an antichrist.

I dont know if its a good idea to refer to a fellow HolyGhost filled, Jesus name baptized peron "an antichrist".

He's still preaching repentance, people are still getting baptized and filled under his ministry. Seems to me that God is still using the Ethiopian church there.
Seems to me he's still very pro-gospel and pro-Christ, not anti-Christ.

Maybe we should just not be so harsh in our words and our judgment of the situation, and just let the Lord sort it all out.

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I think they teach another Jesus other then the one the Apostles taught.

Originally Posted by Apprehended

I've heard that. I'm not convinced. It seems to me that their perspective on the same Jesus is a bit skewed. But, if every oneness believer was lost because of a skewed understanding of the One God, Jesus, there would not be very many oneness believers saved.

Good point. If you asked 5 different UPCI apostolics to define the Godhead, you might get 5 somewhat different answers. Doesn't mean they're not saved.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Good point. If you asked 5 different UPCI apostolics to define the Godhead, you might get 5 somewhat different answers. Doesn't mean they're not saved.

This is NOT the same. This doctrine attacks redemption at it's basic core. The seed of the woman-Abraham-David is our redeemer Teke's Jesus has NO ties to any of them.
Jesus becoming man is the doctrine of the Godhead Teke's doctrine teaches Jesus was NOT really a man.
Teke's doctrine denies the virgin birth and just makes Mary an incubator only.
Teke's doctrine acutally denies Jesus has come in the flesh thus he is a anti-christ.
Teke's doctrine places him outside the Apostolic church.

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I think they teach another Jesus other then the one the Apostles taught.

OK.
But even if we say that is the case...if God is still filling people with the Holy Ghost under their ministry, couldnt we take that to mean that God does'nt see their doctrinal error to be enough for Him to withhold His Spirit from them?

And back to the original question, if they're baptized in His name and filled with His Spirit, are they not saved, according to the scriptures? Sems like it to me.

(Just trying to think this through here.)