Can A Person Be A Smoker & Still Be Saved

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

What does Paul mean by "defile the temple"?

What is your interpretation?

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

What is your interpretation?

Here's Strongs: to corrupt, to destroy
in the opinion of the Jews, the temple was corrupted or "destroyed" when anyone defiled or in the slightest degree damaged anything in it, or if its guardians neglected their duties
to lead away a Christian church from that state of knowledge and holiness in which it ought to abide
to be destroyed, to perish
in an ethical sense, to corrupt, deprave

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Here's Strongs: to corrupt, to destroy
in the opinion of the Jews, the temple was corrupted or "destroyed" when anyone defiled or in the slightest degree damaged anything in it, or if its guardians neglected their duties
to lead away a Christian church from that state of knowledge and holiness in which it ought to abide
to be destroyed, to perish
in an ethical sense, to corrupt, deprave

I'm not arguing that point, I guess my question to you is this - is it ONLY tobacco that defiles our bodies?

[ForeverBlessed]

I do not look as this physical body as a holding cell or a physical building "temple" of the Holy Ghost… as in a container that holds something.

I feel it is referencing a more spiritual governing than physical building.... going to attempt to explain what I see it as. Eph 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,

Dwell is used often as
katoikevw - to dwell, settle
a. metaph. divine powers, influences, etc., are said to dwell in his soul, to pervade, prompt, govern it
to dwell in, inhabit
b. God is said to dwell in the temple, i.e. to be always present for worshippers

1 Co 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

“Dwell in” here is Enoikeo to dwell in metaph. to dwell in one and influence him (for good)

We are governed or influenced by the Holy Ghost… the Spirit is present in our words, actions, deeds… it over takes the old….makes us new through changes in our behavior by influence. The Holy Ghost shouldn’t be viewed as a magic potion that “poofs” fills this physical body up and we “hold” him within us like a container and because we are “filled” we are automatically good... or produce good things. It takes action on our part... We submit to him, he takes control. I believe the initial evidence of that control is speaking in tongues…. the continued evidence is by what is revealed in our actions or “Fruit of the Spirit”

As we submit our will to him and his ways, the more we reflect Jesus Christ. We submit ourselves through prayer and applying the Word, walking in fellowship with him.

Good lord.... I said all of that to say this about smoking...

I do believe that a believer could struggle with smoking…and still be striving. Depending upon the growth level of their walk with God. I am not sure how long that could take place until which it would become an issue of not allowing the Holy Ghost to take control of their habit...resulting in death.

We are told "lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us," Heb 12:1 (I take this to mean we will deal as believers with sin....it is up to us to lay it aside)

Just as with gluttony (that is far more than food) and other sins of the flesh… The sins will be revealed to you by the Spirit... it is up to us to submit those things… to offer our bodies as instruments of righteousness. The result of not submitting as with any sin is spiritual death.

Romans 6:13 Do not offer the parts of your body to sin, as instruments of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God, as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer the parts of your body to him as instruments of righteousness. 14For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace. 5 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves, you are slaves to the one whom you obey—whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you wholeheartedly obeyed the form of teaching to which you were entrusted. 18You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.

[MikeinAR]

Originally Posted by ForeverBlessed

The Holy Ghost shouldn’t be viewed as a magic potion that “poofs” fills this physical body up and we “hold” him within us like a container and because we are “filled” we are automatically good... or produce good things. It takes action on our part... We submit to him, he takes control. I believe the initial evidence of that control is speaking in tongues…. the continued evidence is by what is revealed in our actions or “Fruit of the Spirit”

Forever, your entire post is fantastic and I agree with it 100%. The quoted paragraph above should be required reading for new converts and those that are new to the baptism of the Holy Ghost. Action combined with submission to the spirit of God will lead to changed lives in every area.

The amazing thing is when it's done through humble submission to the Holy Ghost with him leading a person, they find theirself convicted of things they hadn't expected or even thought of as wrong. Personal submission to the Holy Ghost daily and his will will change people much more effectively than programs and workshops and guidelines, IMO.

[MikeinAR]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Here's Strongs: to corrupt, to destroy
in the opinion of the Jews, the temple was corrupted or "destroyed" when anyone defiled or in the slightest degree damaged anything in it, or if its guardians neglected their duties
to lead away a Christian church from that state of knowledge and holiness in which it ought to abide
to be destroyed, to perish
in an ethical sense, to corrupt, deprave

So, for the idea of sound doctrine, we could include those old saints that worry too much and cause unneccesary stress on their body. We could include any diabetic that doesn't conform to a strict sugar free diet. We could include any person at risk of heart disease who splurges on the occasional red meat. We could include those of us who drink soda which will literally remove varnish from a wood floor if it's left on it. And we'd most definitely, have to clean out the Pizza Parlours on Sunday night across the south and mid-west full of saint's filling their bodies with defiling food leaving them at risk for obesity and all of the infirmities and diseases that appertain.

Well at least we got that all cleared up. I'll go have some H20 and lettuce.

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by MikeinAR

So, for the idea of sound doctrine, we could include those old saints that worry too much and cause unneccesary stress on their body. We could include any diabetic that doesn't conform to a strict sugar free diet. We could include any person at risk of heart disease who splurges on the occasional red meat. We could include those of us who drink soda which will literally remove varnish from a wood floor if it's left on it. And we'd most definitely, have to clean out the Pizza Parlours on Sunday night across the south and mid-west full of saint's filling their bodies with defiling food leaving them at risk for obesity and all of the infirmities and diseases that appertain.

Well at least we got that all cleared up. I'll go have some H20 and lettuce.

Thank you, my goatee-d friend! You have stated my own thoughts much more eloquently than I could......

oh, by the way, make sure it's purified water, not from the tap.....and make sure the lettuce has no pesticides!

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by MikeinAR

So, for the idea of sound doctrine, we could include those old saints that worry too much and cause unneccesary stress on their body. We could include any diabetic that doesn't conform to a strict sugar free diet. We could include any person at risk of heart disease who splurges on the occasional red meat. We could include those of us who drink soda which will literally remove varnish from a wood floor if it's left on it. And we'd most definitely, have to clean out the Pizza Parlours on Sunday night across the south and mid-west full of saint's filling their bodies with defiling food leaving them at risk for obesity and all of the infirmities and diseases that appertain.

Well at least we got that all cleared up. I'll go have some H20 and lettuce.

Work out your own salvation with God.

If you think smoking is okay and that you're not defiling your body, God's temple, then do what pleases you and what you feel pleases the Holy Spirit.

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

Work out your own salvation with God.

If you think smoking is okay and that you're not defiling your body, God's temple, then do what pleases you and what you feel pleases the Holy Spirit.

Miz, this is not like you.

You're avoiding the question.

Here's my question - do you feel that the edict to defile not the temple ONLY applies to smoking?

Or, do you feel that the same unhealthy habits that so many have mentioned on here, like overeating, fall into the same category - the one that will send you to hell?

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

Miz, this is not like you.

You're avoiding the question.

Here's my question - do you feel that the edict to defile not the temple ONLY applies to smoking?

Or, do you feel that the same unhealthy habits that so many have mentioned on here, like overeating, fall into the same category - the one that will send you to hell?

No, these verses, IMHO, apply to all unhealthy habits.

Taking the verses literally, which I tend to do, then I find fault even with myself.

Do we give ourselves a pass and say these verses don't really mean what they say? Do we gloss over them? What does defiling the temple, our bodies, mean? If they mean harming the body, then we are answerable to God for what we do to His temple. It's as simple as that and as hard as that.