Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
It was a jury trial. It's not as if it was some judge with an agenda, the jury found her testimony credible. Most of us have made up our minds not after hearing all the evidence but after reading a 4 paragraph news story.
Baron, read the initial things she was saying to the police...before a lawyer told her what made sense to say if trying to build a defense. She did not lawyer up immediately and did give many statements that would have gotten any man crucified for sure. This jury was one of the worst since the one that let Mel Ignatow get away with murder because they didn't like the length of the main witness' skirt. The facts of this case make 9 months a travesty.
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Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstew
Baron, read the initial things she was saying to the police...before a lawyer told her what made sense to say if trying to build a defense. She did not lawyer up immediately and did give many statements that would have gotten any man crucified for sure. This jury was one of the worst since the one that let Mel Ignatow get away with murder because they didn't like the length of the main witness' skirt. The facts of this case make 9 months a travesty.
You don't think the jury heard those statements. And ethically an attorney cannot tell you how to testify. The jury had doubts about her guilt of anything less than manslaughter.
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Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
You don't think the jury heard those statements. And ethically an attorney cannot tell you how to testify. The jury had doubts about her guilt of anything less than manslaughter.
Baron, I don't just do the soundbites. I followed that thing on Court TV, that jury was nuts and they just looked at her and could not convict her. I know that you know as well as anyone, that as good as our system is, there have been some loony juries.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstew
Baron, I don't just do the soundbites. I followed that thing on Court TV, that jury was nuts and they just looked at her and could not convict her. I know that you know as well as anyone, that as good as our system is, there have been some loony juries.
Think about getting 12 people totally fooled at the same time. It might happen but it would be rare. I remember one jury that I watched all the way through in a case the ACLJ was trying against a Planned Parenthood security gaurd. There was one woman who was more concerned with what us interns were doing than with the trial her I.Q. probably wasn't high enough for her to be executed, no way she had any idea what was going on. but she was one out of eight or nine whatever it was not the whole jury.
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
Think about getting 12 people totally fooled at the same time. It might happen but it would be rare. I remember one jury that I watched all the way through in a case the ACLJ was trying against a Planned Parenthood security gaurd. There was on woman who was more concerned with what us interns were doing than with the trial he I.Q. probably wasn't high enough for her to be executed, no way she had any idea what was going on. but she was one out of eight or nine whatever it was not the whole jury.
Baron, just look at some of the case evidence. I guarantee you that she would not be free today if you had been on that jury. Some people are just not convicted for a myriad of reasons...they just look too innocent, they can appeal to emotions, etc. Just wait til the "American Justice" episode is done on this one.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstew
Baron, just look at some of the case evidence. I guarantee you that she would not be free today if you had been on that jury. Some people are just not convicted for a myriad of reasons...they just look too innocent, they can appeal to emotions, etc. Just wait til the "American Justice" episode is done on this one.
Yup. She is this mousy shy little 30ish bookworm looking woman I am sure they felt sorry for. I mean she is a widow after all !!!!! Who doesn't feel sorry for a widow?
__________________ "I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
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Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
You don't think the jury heard those statements. And ethically an attorney cannot tell you how to testify. The jury had doubts about her guilt of anything less than manslaughter.
Baron Von Frankenstein,
I was the jury foreman on a murder trail in Texas where it was absolutely clear that the woman had killed the man and yet when we went to deliberate and I suggested we first have a secret poll as to our positions there were 10 guilty votes and two not guilty.
I had allowed three choices. Guilty of murder, Guilty of manslaughter, or not guilty.
Jury's can be unpredictable.
__________________ "I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
Baron Von Frankenstein,
I was the jury foreman on a murder trail in Texas where it was absolutely clear that the woman had killed the man and yet when we went to deliberate and I suggested we first have a secret poll as to our positions there were 10 guilty votes and two not guilty.
I had allowed three choices. Guilty of murder, Guilty of manslaughter, or not guilty.
Jury's can be unpredictable.
Sure they can. There is this thing called resonable doubt, that just grabs ahold of them sometimes.
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron1710
Sure they can. There is this thing called resonable doubt, that just grabs ahold of them sometimes.
It only grabbed our two "not guilty's" for about four hours and they were also convinced of the woman's guilt.
Thankfully she chose to have the judge set her sentance so we didn't have to do that.
Even though she deserved whatever punishment she got for taking a young man's life it was heart rending knowing that whatever happened this 56 year old woman was going to spend the rest of her productive life behind bars.
As the jury foreman I had to stand and read the verdict with her staring at me. However remembering the crime scene photos and autopsy photos we had to view I had no problem doing it.
__________________ "I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
Re: Murderer Pastor's Wife Regains Custody of Chil
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
It only grabbed our two "not guilty's" for about four hours and they were also convinced of the woman's guilt.
Thankfully she chose to have the judge set her sentance so we didn't have to do that.
Even though she deserved whatever punishment she got for taking a young man's life it was heart rending knowing that whatever happened this 56 year old woman was going to spend the rest of her productive life behind bars.
As the jury foreman I had to stand and read the verdict with her staring at me. However remembering the crime scene photos and autopsy photos we had to view I had no problem doing it.
What your telling us is the system worked.
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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